Smart Parking LTD PCN Asda Carpark

Redx

no problem m8, I was only interested in clarifying it for others , like you have done , seeing as the points were raised by the OP

it just annoys me that these companies think they can get away with this type of discrimination in general (although it may not apply to the OP in this case)

I was diagnosed with a protected characteristic in the 1980`s and have had an orange and blue badge for most of the time since and still do

if my BB expires or isnt renewed in continuity with the old one, the asda argument would be that I cannot park in a disabled spot which are provided for people like me, yet I cannot suddenly "get better" as my condition is incurable (but not life threatening) and so I am protected by the EA2010 but according to their blurb above I am no longer able to park there even though the EA2010 doesnt mention the BB and asda would be discriminating against me and breaking the law

should it ever happen, they will be receiving similar emails and letters, if necessary an MCOL would follow a bit like fergie86 and his long running saga with the hospital and apcoa

it really needs a successful MCOL against people like asda to make them raise their game, the government was talking about changing the law or rules so that "they" would take the retailer etc to task instead of the individual, once it has been reported, like say , a criminal offence

ie:- I would report it and somebody would investigate it and take it further, instead of leaving it up to each and every person individually (like I would have to, or as trubster had to with meadowhall and his disabled family member)

lee246

Thank you again Redx.

I've put together the following email using the information you've supplied. Please feel free to correct it if you think I've constructed it wrong:


To whom this may concern,

The Equality Act 2010 does not mention the Blue Badge scheme at all, it is not a qualifying factor, however you (Asda) are under the obligation of the law to follow the Equality Act 2010 for each and every qualifying person under the act.


‘Disability: The Act applies to a range of people that have a condition (physical or mental) which has a significant and long-term adverse effect on their ability to carry out ‘normal’ day-to-day activities. This protection also applies to people that have been diagnosed with a progressive illness such as HIV or cancer.

Pregnancy and Maternity (including breastfeeding mothers): A woman is protected against discrimination on the grounds of pregnancy and maternity.’


With this in mind, what would you (Asda) expect a pregnant, or new mother to do when they are protected under the Equality Act 2010 yet your Policy and Signage positively discriminates against them?


Or if a passenger in the vehicle has a qualifying disability and the driver of the vehicle parks in the bay due to the fact they need to because of the recognised disability of the passenger in question?


‘3. What behaviour is unlawful?

A: Under the Act people are not allowed to discriminate, harass or victimise another person because they have any of the protected characteristics. There is also protection against discrimination where someone is perceived to have one of the protected characteristics or where they are associated with someone who has a protected characteristic.

• Discrimination means treating one person worse than another because of a protected characteristic (known as direct discrimination) or putting in place a rule or policy or way of doing things that has a worse impact on someone with a protected characteristic than someone without one, when this cannot be objectively justified (known as indirect discrimination). Harassment includes unwanted conduct related to a protected characteristic which has the purpose or effect or violating someone’s dignity or which creates a hostile, degrading, humiliating or offensive environment for someone with a protected characteristic.
• Victimisation is treating someone unfavourably because they have taken (or might be taking) action under the Equality Act or supporting somebody who is doing so.’

As such you (Asda), are effectively colluding in breaking the law in order to enforce these parking charges on your own customers.


I expect a response instead of being ignored.


Regards, L.

Redx

no problem m8

its the sort of questions I would be putting to them if I had been discriminated against , but I do qualify under the act so the BB is immaterial , although they seem to think that its the only qualifying factor according to their correspondence with you

I appreciate you are on a sticky wicket with your circumstances above, but its still a point that needs addressing, just unfortunate that I am not in a position to be making these points as I dont have a parking invoice from asda (yet) so cannot take umbrage with them (or any other retailer until they breach my rights under the EA2010)

I have had arguments with other "official bodies" and had to point out their shortcomings at times in relation to the laws, or rules, in place at certain times of my life, because if you are not careful people will try to implement current practice (which is how they were trained) over previous practice , which was say the rules or laws at the time I was diagnosed or dealt with

so on here, a thread today was ukcps from a year ago, they were BPA members back then, so I implemented the advice for telling them to try to invoke popla , as ukcps had to offer popla 12 months ago

frankly, I am appalled by what asda are telling you , not necessarily for your case, but how they would respond if it was me with the same ticket !! they are clearly not trained in how the EA2010 should be implemented, despite it being in force for the last 5 years

those spaces are provided by law under the EA2010 for disabled people like me, but they can also use their discretion and allow people with temporary disabilities like your friend to use them as well on occasion, so common sense has not prevailed here

one example was tesco (but not a BB incident)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-29652764

and this was the recent survey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-31713891

I also notice they say they comply under the BPA CoP, but I doubt they have read it

it says (in 2014)

16 Disabled motorists

16.1 The Equality Act 2010 says that providers of services to
the public must make ‘reasonable adjustments’ to remove
barriers which may discriminate against disabled people.

16.2 ‘Reasonable adjustments’ to prevent discrimination are
likely to include larger ‘disabled’ parking spaces near to
the entrance or amenities for disabled people whose
mobility is impaired.

It also could include lowered payment machines and other ways to pay if payment isrequired: for example, paying by phone.
You and your staff also need to realise that some disabled people may take a long time to get to the payment machine.

16.3 Operators of off-street car parks do not have to recognise the Blue Badge scheme. But many choose to do so to meet their obligations under the equality Act.

Although a Blue Badge is not issued to all disabled people it is issued to those with mobility problems.

So it is a good way for parking operators to identify people who need special parking provision.

16.4 You are at risk of a claim under the Equality Act if you do not discourage abuse of the ‘disabled’ spaces.
This means that you need to make sure the spaces are regularly checked to be sure they are not being used by people who do not have a disability.

16.5 If your landowner provides a concession that allows parking for disabled people, if a vehicle displays a valid Blue Badge you must not issue it with parking charge notices.

even the BPA acknowledge that not all disabled people qualify for a BB, but recognise that it is ONE METHOD of identifying those people who definitely DO qualify under the EA2010

they do not identify how anybody else that qualifies under the act should be made to tell the landowner how they qualify, but they acknowledge that some disabled people who qualify under the EA2010 dont have blue badges

the BPA working clearly states that it does not absolve the operator under the EA2010 and actually warns them that not all disabled people have blue badges

the government used to have a green badge scheme for people like me, as proof of entitlement due to disability, but withdrew that scheme years ago , so we have nothing to prove the disability , other than doctors notes or specialist notes in medical records

atilla

lee246 wrote: »

I'm not under any illusion that we should be entitled to park there. It was a genuine mistake on my behalf as I have never needed to use disabled bays previously and presumed they were available for anyone with a disability, be it long term or short term. Also to note is the sign outlying Asda's T&C's for the disable bay is tiny. It was only once the PCN was issued and I went looking that I found it.


Anyway, small update from my Asda correspondence, but no further on:
Asda response:


Good Morning Mr L

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my email.

The disabled bays are provided as an obligation under the terms of the Equality Act 2010.

The Blue Badge Scheme Booklet, available from the Department for Transport, outlines parking concession for badge holders. The booklet clearly states that the badge does not always apply on private car parks and roads. It also directs badge holders to read the signs in the car park for terms and conditions of parking.

The car park is a private car park and so full concessions for disabled badge holders are not guaranteed, although disabled bays may be provided. The car park is private land and the owners allow access to the public on condition that they park according to the advertised terms and conditions, the signs warn that non-compliance may result in a parking charge notice. Persons entering the car park are, in effect, agreeing to the terms and conditions and if they park in breach of the terms and conditions the landowner has a right to make a charge

Motorists are advised to ensure that they read signs upon entering the site and ensure that they hold a valid blue badge as this must be displayed when using the designated disabled bays. If the motorists does not agree to the advertised terms and conditions they will incur a parking charge notice as stated on the signs.

In addition, the signage at the entrance and also around the car park are written in clearly and intelligible language as per the BPA requirements. There is no ambiguous language or jargon on any of the Smart Parking signs at this site. Moreover, the signs are located at a height so they are visible by any individual regardless of their height,. It is the responsibility of the motorists to ensure that they acknowledge the signs and park accordingly. All signage is BPA approved.

In order to have this notice quashed you would have to appeal directly to Smart Parking.

Kind regards

E
Executive Relations


My response:


Morning E,


Have you actually been to the site in question? There is one small sign, roughly about 10 foot high, and about 1 foot wide. This sign isn’t visible from the bay in which my car was parked, along with most other bays near to it, apart from the bay directly below it. It’s also not clear what is written on it unless you walk directly below it as the font is so small.


As landowner, you have to power to quash any and all PCN’s given out on your land, so failure to do this is a choice of Asda.





Regards, L.

I'll put good money on that response being penned by someone at 'not so smart'.

lee246

I finally got a response:
Good Morning


Thanks for coming back to me.


Our policy is within legislation, we do not discriminate we simply require a valid blue badge to park in a disable space, as the signs advise.


We would now consider the matter closed, if you wish to take the matter further, you would need to seek third party advice.


E.

Redx

so they ducked the issue then , typical

Guys_Dad

As said, you are barking up the wrong tree quoting legislation that does not apply to temporary injuries,

It is a shame that you didn't have a visiting foreign disabled relative in the car who would never be entitled to a BB as they were not resident in the UK. You could then have scared the cr*p out of them by threatening racial discrimination !

You should now write to/email the CEO of ASDA enclosing the original letter from their "Customer Relations" person telling him that you were surprised that a major supermarket would employ such an ill-informed person as their customer service spokesperson.

I would say that your friend with the leg problem asked you to take them to what was their favourite supermarket for shopping rather than going elsewhere and that you would ask ASDA under the circumstances to extend a goodwill gesture. Ask if a letter from a Doctor would help sway the decision.

When it comes down to it, Equality issues cut absolutely no sway with POPLA who deal with Parking, not Equality. If the PPC/ASDA don't make a goodwill gesture, then you will need to rely on the Contract/GPEOL/Signs standard points.

One last point, however, are ASDA the landowners or do they simply lease the land? The reason is that even if ASDA have a valid contract with the PPC, unless the actual landowner has in their contract with an ASDA lease any provision to allow parking limitations and charges, then the ADSA/PPC contract may be void.

If ADSA are only the leaseholders, you should demand to see the ASDA/landowner contract/lease.

lee246

Thank you both for the replies.
Asda aren't actually aware the injury is temporary, I only sent them a picture of my friend in the car park on that day with crutches and a brace. I think the mention of legislation was advised as a response to the clear unwilling to look any further into the matter from the Customer Relations lady.
I did actually email the CEO and the response came from her so I'd imagine he doesn't deal with such a lowly matter of disgruntled customers.
I'll see if I can somehow find who owns the land and see if that avenue car be pursued.
Failing that I'd imagine I just go through the usual POPLA appeal process?

lee246

Just got back off holiday and still nothing from Smart Parking, no letters, calls, communication etc. Think I'll be roughly at 25 days now.
What do I do now?

Redx

you said you were going to send the appeal template around day 21 to day 25 , so do so (as per posts #2 and #3 and #4)

smart cannot get keeper details until more than 28 days have elapsed, therefore how could you have received anything at all from them ? (just not possible)

do you understand the timelines involved on this ?