Fence issue with neighbour and landlord

judywoody

maninthestreet wrote: »

Am I the only one that can't see in the pictures the gate on the RHS that prevents the OP from accessing that side of the frontage and side of the property?

My post states that this picture was taken before he put the fence up

judywoody

DaftyDuck wrote: »

You are seeing things from only one point of view, and getting pretty inflammatory in the process.



No, but you hadn't discussed the bamboo, and had intended to plant the area.... For all the other tenant knows, your next move is to install a barbecue... he doesn't know your ideas until you discuss them. When they involve part of what he might think of as his garden, it's even more advisable.



No, of course not, and you are contractually obliged to keep it weed free.... except...

.... your neighbour has done you the favour of taking sole responsibility for this area, thus alleviating you of that burden.



Why should he have to remove it? Should have been discussed before it went up.



Doesn't really do much for privacy for the upstairs windows, and would look pretty scruffy from those downstairs, in my personal opinion. He may well like watching the World drift by his window....

.. In my world, a cheap and rather tatty bamboo screen certainly does not add to the front garden... and I'm pretty well-known on this forum as a meticulous gardener.

I'm not... I'm just not taking your side either. You seem to expect everyone on here to agree with you.... any other opinion is a chav, or troll, or whatever.

As far as I can tell, you have a right of access via the front. Not use of the garden (unless your contract states differently). You should keep the area weed-free. You do not have the use of any part of the garden other than that needed for access. The other tenant has, presumably, a right to use "the garden" which, it appears, he seems to think, includes that part of "the garden" on the other side from the part you need for access.

We would have removed the bamboo if he had actually said something. He didn't take responsibility as he has no track record of keeping anything weed free. in fact, they started growing again.
So I am supposed to communicate and he doesn't have to?
The problem is, we tried to actually communicate but he ignores us. We had the feeling he is generally not bothered about what happens with the garden anyway, whatever we could do would, if anything, be an improvement.


So I have no right of access but should keep the area weed free? How is that supposed to be fair?? Communal area means we BOTH have a responsibility. I don't really understand your last paragraph , it doesn't make any sense to me. Fact is, he has the back and the front now as well he can claim for himself. And as long as he keeps it tidy, I don't really mind. But his track record proofs that he doesn't. And my question is, just because the contract didn't state it, does that mean he has sole usage of this area by default? I can't imagine that. There must be a law that states what is communal and what isn't when nothing is mentioned in the contract.

Anyhoo, the fact is that we have now a lot less garden area and to me it seems that this is a reduction in space forced on us. I will be contacting CAB to see if that justifies a reduction in rent.

judywoody

Blackpool_Saver wrote: »

Don't live in a flat, get a house then you can make it how you want, you can't force other people to do things. I know how you feel, I am sick to death of the behaviour of my neighbours and their wild hellion children BUT I can only deal with my own area, you can't force others to be clean and tidy.

Yeah I wish I could do that...

DaftyDuck

It does not warrant a reduction in rent, I'd be pretty certain of that. Does your contract assign you any rights to garden space, aside from that needed for access? If it doesn't explicitly state you have such use, you have no rights to use it as such, and have lost no garden space. You still have access to the flat, and to the bins. Any arrangement between the LL and the lower tenant are just that - and you are not party to them if you have contractually lost nothing.

As to his need to keep it tidy, that's a moot point. One person's tidy is another's wilderness garden, is a third person's unruly weed-strewn junkyard. If he has been allocated sole use, and sole responsibility for it, how he keeps it is solely between him and the LL - you have no say, not even if he keeps old washing machines and sofas there. If you don't like that, find somewhere else where you have such control yourself. As you no longer have access to one side, the LL has clearly relieved you of responsibility for weeding that area; that's now the lower tenant's sole responsibility.

Do realise, what you may regard as improvement, he may well not. Frankly, in the position you both find yourselves in, I'm surprised you have any rights to either side. As a LL, I'd want the ground floor flat to benefit from privacy. As the ground floor tenant, I'd much prefer not to have anyone outside my window, and would prefer a small fenced bin area directly onto the front path, leaving both sides free for the ground floor user. Which would be yours, had you had that flat, his if he did.


No, both are supposed to communicate, if they want anything from the other. I'm not sure the other tenant does want anything from you, though.

To re-phrase my last paragraph, which you didn't understand. The other tenant has a contract also, which presumably gives him "use of the garden", and possibly "exclusive use of the garden". Your contract, I believe (and please correct me if wrong) grants you access to your flat through the front... not use of the front garden. I'm suggesting that the other tenant may strongly believe that the side front garden forms part of the.... garden, and is strictly for his own use, not for yours. His privacy through the windows would suggest that is the case.

If your contract doesn't explicitly state you have use of the (front) garden, then all you are able to do is use it to move through... oh, and keep the part you use weed free. That's it. No gardening, fence erecting, table-and-chair sitting, no barbecue... just moving through!

Tixy

judywoody wrote: »

We would have removed the bamboo if he had actually said something. He didn't take responsibility as he has no track record of keeping anything weed free. in fact, they started growing again.
So I am supposed to communicate and he doesn't have to?

Ideally you would have communicated/ checked first with the landlord, the agent or even the tenant.
It is likely your actions and lack of initial communication that has resulted in this situation as it is now.

judywoody wrote: »

The problem is, we tried to actually communicate but he ignores us. We had the feeling he is generally not bothered about what happens with the garden anyway, whatever we could do would, if anything, be an improvement.

Obviously your feeling was wrong.

judywoody wrote: »

So I have no right of access but should keep the area weed free? How is that supposed to be fair?? Communal area means we BOTH have a responsibility.

It has now been established that it is not a communal area, you have no responsibility in relation to weeding.

judywoody wrote: »

Fact is, he has the back and the front now as well he can claim for himself.

So it would appear. This may have always been the case. And is irrelevant.

judywoody wrote: »

And as long as he keeps it tidy, I don't really mind. But his track record proofs that he doesn't.

He is under no obligation to you to keep it tidy, whether you mind or not.

judywoody wrote: »

And my question is, just because the contract didn't state it, does that mean he has sole usage of this area by default? I can't imagine that. There must be a law that states what is communal and what isn't when nothing is mentioned in the contract.

judywoody wrote: »

Anyhoo, the fact is that we have now a lot less garden area and to me it seems that this is a reduction in space forced on us. I will be contacting CAB to see if that justifies a reduction in rent.

You assumed it was communal.
You don't have anything in your contract that specifically relates to which areas are communal or specifically about the land to the front of the property - is that correct?
You didn't specifically ask the landlord or the agent about the piece of land or use of it - is that correct?
Was there any mention of the strip of land in the agent's advert for letting the property?

You have no idea what is in the other tenant's contract with the landlord - is that correct?

roundturn

Can I jump in here? I live downstairs.

This couple moved in and started acting like they own the place. I've lived here for years. The previous tenant upstairs was fine - we had a good relationship, remote but amicable. This couple just do what they want.

I came home one day to find this ghastly fence had appeared. No discussion, no request, just there it was blocking my view of the street and not even providing an alternative attractive view.

Frankly they're lucky I didn't rip it up and shove the bits through their letter box, but I'm not by nature aggresive, so just left it. Yes, after that I erected a gate so they at least kept out of the way of one of my windows.

I spoke to the agent because I prefer things to be done properly. I certainly didn't want a discussion with people who seem to have no consideration for other people's feelings.

This should be left to the agents.

Daerve

roundturn wrote: »

Can I jump in here?

My condolences. :rotfl:

judywoody

I have only time for a short note. I took a picture of the fence which I can post tomorrow.

With regards to the contract, we have spoken to the agency and neither one of us has a bespoke contract. It just seems to be a template due to laziness of the landlord /agency. It does say to keep communal garden areas tidy. whatever that means. This isn't just about rights but common decency. It seems to be ok to not look after communal areas but if someone tries to make a place look nicer (even if its not to your taste) everyone suddenly thinks that's far worse than anything
else, especially if you didn't have an agreement for this. And it was full of weeds, sorry I dont have a before picture. we were really embarrassed to invite people to our house. yes, the ground floor windows are his but we have the front entrance so most people associate the house with us.

So privacy is a point but it seems to be ok for him to let his dog poo in his backyard so we have a nice view out of the kitchen window..

it seems whatever we do we have no rights whatsoever.

judywoody

roundturn wrote: »

Can I jump in here? I live downstairs.

This couple moved in and started acting like they own the place. I've lived here for years. The previous tenant upstairs was fine - we had a good relationship, remote but amicable. This couple just do what they want.

I came home one day to find this ghastly fence had appeared. No discussion, no request, just there it was blocking my view of the street and not even providing an alternative attractive view.

Frankly they're lucky I didn't rip it up and shove the bits through their letter box, but I'm not by nature aggresive, so just left it. Yes, after that I erected a gate so they at least kept out of the way of one of my windows.

I spoke to the agent because I prefer things to be done properly. I certainly didn't want a discussion with people who seem to have no consideration for other people's feelings.

This should be left to the agents.

seems like a great neighbour, maybe you forgot about the weeds. and the fact that the front area isn't his, it's communal.

Daerve

judywoody wrote: »

it seems whatever we do we have no rights whatsoever.

You have lots of rights, just not the right to hack someone else's weeds down without asking them first you cheeky sod.

If I lived next door to you I wouldn't bother with a gate, I'd dig a moat and fill it with laser beam toting sharks.