Our kids refused time off school during term time - please advice

ViolaLass

SandC wrote: »

I will consider myself told then. 😁

Actually when I have had friends moaning about the cost of their hols I have often felt like saying they should have thought of that before having kids but I feel they may have ditched me. :-) I still maintain that some of the increases are over the top though. I wasn't talking about gov subsidies just some kind of cap on percentage increases or something, like they do with fuel.

There are caps on fuel prices?

GwylimT

jaylee3 wrote: »

Don't see why having a week off school would make any difference to their progress.

I had two students who were on holiday in term time during their science ISA, it was too inconvenient for their parents to pick them up (obviously fab mum and dad) so they couldn't attend six hours of after school sessions. In August when they open their results their science with be a big fat fail, so they will both have to re-sit the whole course at college.

Jagraf

GwylimT wrote: »

I had two students who were on holiday in term time during their science ISA, it was too inconvenient for their parents to pick them up (obviously fab mum and dad) so they couldn't attend six hours of after school sessions. In August when they open their results their science with be a big fat fail, so they will both have to re-sit the whole course at college.

Hurts doesn't it. I wish parents understood but they just don't seem to want to. I feel really sorry for the kids. My DD has spent the last 8 weeks revising and there is no way we would have missed an ISA or any of the work relating to it. The relationship is between the student and the teacher and the parent is supposed to be supporting their actions, not stopping success by thinking they somehow know best about their gcse almost adult.

notanewuser

SandC wrote: »

I will consider myself told then. 😁

Actually when I have had friends moaning about the cost of their hols I have often felt like saying they should have thought of that before having kids but I feel they may have ditched me. :-) I still maintain that some of the increases are over the top though. I wasn't talking about gov subsidies just some kind of cap on percentage increases or something, like they do with fuel.

Is it an increase or are prices discounted (to encourage sales) during off peak periods? Icecream is often discounted in the winter. Ski wear costs less in the summer. It's basic economics. Don't see anyone complaining about that.

FBaby

What if say 10% of them took off a week each year and required worksheets to take with them and catch-up work once they got back. How much extra work would this generate for you? And how much extra for your colleagues? And what would be the impact on the other kids in your class while you were dealing with the ones who had missed lessons?

You make it sound like this is normal every day teacher's behaviour. Maybe the issue is that you are a very consciencious teacher. My experience is that most teachers rarely know the evel of understanding of a topic for all their student. As a matter of fact, I was quite surprised the number of teachers who still don't even know the name of some of their pupils after Christmas, let alone their level of understanding of each lesson.

It is unrealistic for parents to expect that level of individual teaching in state school. We parents accept this and that if we want a more tailored level of education, we need to pay for it. So it feels a bit insulting to then have teachers accusing parents who take their kids out of school for impacting on their level of understanding of a topic, or giving them more work than normal. Most teachers leave the responsibility of catching up to the pupil and parents and that's how it should be. If they don't do so (and nowadays, there are many means to do so via the internet), then that's when they fail their kids, not when they take them out of school.

Not all parents take their kids out of school not caring about their kids' results. My DD will need to get 'A's in all her results to continue on the education she needs to pursue to achieve the career she is dreaming off and we are certainly making sure that she gets there. I just don't believe that having missed two days of school is going to ruin this, on the opposite, the holiday allowed her to get a very good break mentally and physically and that has prepared her to the her end of year exams much better than any other way.

Taking your child out of school doesn't systematically mean that you value fun over education. It might do for some parents, and not to others depending on the circumstances.

Pollycat

lynsayjane wrote: »

Up here we call it the 'tattie holidays' as it originated that kids were off to help their parents with the harvest. Was 2 weeks the whole time I was in school and in Perth and Kinross (where I was schooled) the calendar shows two weeks just last year too.

We used to call it tater picking holiday too. I used to go with my Grandma, pay was 12 shillings & sixpence per half day. :eek:

Back then, half term was 3 days - Wednesday, Thursday & Friday.

FBaby

It's also deeply divisive - a kid returning with a tan and fantastic tales of exciting trips - how does that make the kid whose family cannot afford a holiday feel? Although it inevitably happens to some extent, it's less obvious when the holiday is taken during the standard holidays.

Really don't see how it makes any difference to when the holiday is taken. What makes a difference is kids who brag vs kids who have learnt to eat humble pies.

nikkit72

It's classed as unauthorised absence, as schools are no longer allowed to allow holiday absence unless it's for exceptional circumstances,
you MAY be fined, not always the case, when I took my little one out of school the week before half term 4 weeks ago, I was told noone in the school, had been fined before, it's just luck of the draw if the government should investigate the absence,
even if you are fined it's £60 per CHILD, so not a great fine, especially when you consider the difference in costs of term time holidays.

But when my little one went back to school, I was shocked at how many steps he had taken back, by having 2 weeks off, and blame myself for not continuing with some reading and maths while we were away, he is only 5 years old, but wow, it took him a week or so to get back into his reading and school work, if I was to take him out of school again, I would Def be doing some school work with him while we are away,

Petra_70

Tropez wrote: »

That seems fair and reasonable. Locking up some probably loving parents for three months and potentially harming their financial futures over a holiday.

I had a week off in term-time when I was 12. I also missed the best part of a year through illness at one point during secondary school. Still got mostly A's and A*'s and never had to retake the year I missed.

I wonder, if instead of applying some sort of one-size-fits-all policy based on this assumption that school education is the most important thing in the world for all children (it isn't), would it not be more prudent to undo the insanity of the current system and give schools more leeway to make decisions on whether to authorise an absence based on what they know about the children in question?

If a child is, as the OP described, achieving satisfactory (although I admit that term is subjective) grades and does have a solid attendance record, the damage a week off will do to their education is minimal. However, if a child is underperforming and/or has a shaky attendance record then it would seem quite reasonable to not authorise the absence.

This is a good post. It seems silly to adopt a 'one size fits all' policy. Surely they should take each child on its own merit. That is what the schools around our area tend to do. If a child has good attendance, and they have good grades, the school will be all right with a week off. If not, they will refuse it. It is at the Headmaster's discretion

pinkshoes wrote: »

Half my classes are GCSE.
.
You are right, education IS precious, but education is also more than just sitting in a classroom all day.

Absolutely.

fierystormcloud wrote: »

These 3 :T

A child kept out of school for one or two weeks a year is no more likely to be a failure in life and fail their education, than a child who is NOT taken out of school for holidays is going to be a professor of physics.

Indeed, as some have said, children who are taken off on a PROPER holiday, to the Inca Trail or the Himalayas or America or Australia or Asia or Africa etc, tend to be far more well versed, intelligent, and savvy, and have much more respect for other cultures, and more interest in travelling and expanding their minds.

Weirdly, up to about 6-8 years ago, it was widely accepted to allow children 10 days (2 weeks) absence in school time. So why has it changed?
...

Some good points. I think experiencing different cultures is imperative, and children's minds will be filled with wonderful memories of these lovely holidays, and the travelling with their parents. No point in having a holiday off in school time here in the UK imo, as you can do that in a day or a weekend.

I also think it's a good point that it was allowed across the board, in every school, to have 2 weeks off to take them on holiday, until fairly recently, so I also wonder why it isn't now. As someone said earlier, I don't think there has been any noticeable improvement in the performance of many schools since this rule was implemented.

Jagraf

FBaby wrote: »

You make it sound like this is normal every day teacher's behaviour. Maybe the issue is that you are a very consciencious teacher. My experience is that most teachers rarely know the evel of understanding of a topic for all their student. As a matter of fact, I was quite surprised the number of teachers who still don't even know the name of some of their pupils after Christmas, let alone their level of understanding of each lesson.

It is unrealistic for parents to expect that level of individual teaching in state school. We parents accept this and that if we want a more tailored level of education, we need to pay for it. So it feels a bit insulting to then have teachers accusing parents who take their kids out of school for impacting on their level of understanding of a topic, or giving them more work than normal. Most teachers leave the responsibility of catching up to the pupil and parents and that's how it should be. If they don't do so (and nowadays, there are many means to do so via the internet), then that's when they fail their kids, not when they take them out of school.

Not all parents take their kids out of school not caring about their kids' results. My DD will need to get 'A's in all her results to continue on the education she needs to pursue to achieve the career she is dreaming off and we are certainly making sure that she gets there. I just don't believe that having missed two days of school is going to ruin this, on the opposite, the holiday allowed her to get a very good break mentally and physically and that has prepared her to the her end of year exams much better than any other way.

Taking your child out of school doesn't systematically mean that you value fun over education. It might do for some parents, and not to others depending on the circumstances.

But ....

Taking a child out of school to go on holiday isn't a substitute for bad teaching. That should be tackled by the parent and the school. If it doesn't work then the money spent on holiday can be used for tutoring. I understand not all teaching is good, but a holiday doesn't put that right (teaching is actually made worse by kids being absent so taking children out of school is worsening the problem).

You can't pick and choose which kids deserve a holiday and which don't - can you imagine doing that in the workplace? The rule is there as absence affects a whole class.

Of course your DD will do well because you care - lots of parents don't care about their kids education. That's why the rule is there in the first place.

My DD needs As too. At the present time I have to say she would have missed loads if she had missed a week during year 11. She's bright, but not bright enough to miss lessons. Catching up is truly difficult at this age, in my opinion.