Asked to vacate but forced to stay until the end of notice period

giguil

Hi all,

We (me, my partner and our 4-year-old daughter) have been renting a very nice house in Milton Keynes for the past 4 years and were quite happy there.

We knew that the landlord would eventually want to move back in but we were told that this would probably not happen before another 2 years and that suited us perfectly.

Unfortunately, just 2 weeks ago, we learnt that this wan't meant to be when we received a notice to vacate the house before the 10th of August as the landlord was moving back.

Frankly gutted but but not a lot we could do really, that was his house after all.

So off we went on a house hunt and fortunately we got lucky and found what we thought to be the right one last weekend. We secured it and took it off the market and agreed to move in by the 26th of June.

After all notice was served already, wasn't it?

Well, it apparently doesn't matter and that's why I'm here asking for guidance.

It turns out that we are still liable until the 10th of August and our tenancy agreement (a rolling contract) stipulates that if we serve a 1 month notice we still have to pay until the agreed date a the tenancy payment which happens to be the 29th of each month.

The agency offered us to ask the landlord if he was willing to free us before the end of the notice but he said no because, you know, and here I quote: "he needs to pay for his move"!

So, to sum it up: we are being kicked out of our place but still have to pay until the last minute even though we've already found a place to relocate.
Which means two rents to pay at the same time for more than a month + agency fees + all the usual moving costs (I reckon this should go well over £5000) for a move we didn't want to and hadn't planned at all!

Utterly gutted and profoundly shocked this could even be possible.

Anything we can do?

ShAnE

If you were on a rolling contract then I thought you just had to give 1 full months/rental periods notice so if your rent is due on the 29th handing in your notice now would mean your last day would be July 28th. As June 28th- July 28th is the full month/rental period.

I'm fairly certain if you hand your notice in now it doesn't mean you can leave on 4th July.

But can't see why you have to pay up until August 10th, which seems an odd date if you're on a rolling contract.

pmlindyloo

Can you please confirm what your contract says exactly about going onto a month to month tenancy and how it should be ended?

Sorry, seems to be words missing in your original.

G_M

giguil wrote: »

Hi all,

We .. have been renting a very nice house..for the past 4 years

Unfortunately, just 2 weeks ago, we learnt that this wan't meant to be when we received a notice to vacate the house before the 10th of August as the landlord was moving back.
I assume you mean a S21 Notice? This is not a 'notice to quit'. What is the exact date/wording? "before 10th august"? I doubt it. And if so, it has no legalmeaning.

Frankly gutted but but not a lot we could do really, that was his house after all.

So off we went on a house hunt ...We secured it and....agreed to move in by the 26th of June.

After all notice was served already, wasn't it?
1) A S21 Notice I assume, not notice to quit.
2) if a notice to quit was served, it has no legal meaning.
3) whichever was served, it either had a clear date (10th August) or no clear date so was invalid.

Well, it apparently doesn't matter and that's why I'm here asking for guidance.

It turns out that we are still liable until the 10th of August
Correct
and our tenancy agreement (a rolling contract) stipulates that if we serve a 1 month notice we still have to pay until the agreed date a the tenancy payment which happens to be the 29th of each month.
Correct

The agency offered us to ask the landlord if he was willing to free us before the end of the notice but he said no because, you know, and here I quote: "he needs to pay for his move"!
It seems harsh and selfish, but legally he
a) does not have to accept an early surrender from you and
b) does not have to give a reason

So, to sum it up: we are being kicked out of our place
some time after 10th August, so at least you're not homeless
but still have to pay until the last minute even though we've already found a place to relocate.
Yes, if you take on a 2nd tenancy agreement
Which means two rents to pay at the same time for more than a month + agency fees + all the usual moving costs (I reckon this should go well over £5000) for a move we didn't want to and hadn't planned at all!

Utterly gutted and profoundly shocked this could even be possible.

Anything we can do?

If you serve your own notice on/before 29th June, you can end the tenancy on 29th July.

Read:

* Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

G_M

ShAnE wrote: »

But can't see why you have to pay up until August 10th, which seems an odd date if you're on a rolling contract.

Landlord can serve a S21 (1)(b) give at least 2 calender months notice. It does not have to align to tenancy periods.

Tenant's notice must align to tenancy periods.

See

* Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

nidO

Just a note:

You aren't being kicked out, you're being asked to agree to leave on the 10th of august.

You have various potential matters of recourse here, but an obvious question is:

Are you in a periodic tenancy, or a fixed term, as your post seems to imply both. You need to read your tenancy agreement carefully, because if you are on a periodic tenancy you can (usually) simply give 1 month's notice set to expire on the end of your next rent period, as such currently you can give notice to leave on the 29th of July (as you've missed being able to give notice to the 29th of June).

Alternatively, you could go the hardball route and tell the landlord that you'd like to negotiate earlier surrender, or you won't be giving notice to leave and won't be leaving on the 10th of august (this assumes you haven't already replied to their request agreeing to leave on the 10th as all they're doing is asking you to, nothing is binding until you agree) and force him to gain possession through the courts (which will normally take months) as is your right, potentially massively stuffing up his moving plans.

Of course, this is risky to you because if he's flexible about the date of the 10th of august date he might just say "fine" which leaves you having to back down or continue paying rent on the place while he does go to court.

giguil

@shAne: You are correct, if we hand our notice right now we will have to pay "only" until the 28th but to be honest what really baffles us is the fact that we even have to send our own notice at all.

Since a notice to vacate was served already, one (at least I) would assume that since that's precisely what we're doing that would free us of any ongoing liability.

And quite frankly we are especially gutted by landlord's attitude (did I mention he was a minister?). I know, this is me venting but there doesn't seem to be much else for me to do.

nidO

giguil wrote: »

what really baffles us is the fact that we even have to send our own notice at all.

You have to send your own notice because:

giguil wrote: »

Since a notice to vacate was served already

It hasn't been.
The only parties that can end a tenancy are the tenant, or a court. The only thing a landlord can do is sent a section 21 or section 8 notice (everyone above mentions section 21 but if the LL wants to move back in, they can equally use a section 8) which is basically just them asking you to agree to give them possession.

You can agree to this (by giving notice) or refuse (which then means they have to go through the court to gain possession) but their notice alone does not "kick you out" or end the tenancy.

franklee

How much money have you put down to secure the new property, I'm thinking would it be cheaper to pull out of that and stay put until you can find something with a better date? I'd put it to your current LL that you cannot afford the rent overlap so will be staying put and thus unfortunately cannot guarantee you will be leaving by his preferred date of 10th of August. Then hang on until you've found something suitable and serve your own notice.

The LL can either wait for the end of your notice, negotiate a mutually agreeable end date or go through the courts to evict you. Meanwhile you can take a fine toothcomb through the Section 21 to see if it's valid, e.g. was deposit protected and full prescribed information served etc. If he's got the paperwork exactly right you will have to pay his court fee but again that may be cheaper than the double rent.

If the LL has any sense he will negotiate before it comes to that but beware he many not have any sense.

Pixie5740

As nidO says, the tenancy can only be ended by the tenant or a court. The Section 21 is merely notice that the landlord wants to start the process of regaining possession of the property. If you read the information in the link G_M has provided you'll find all the information you need.

What type of tenancy do you currently have? Fixed or periodic?

giguil

@Pixie5740 @nidO: We started with a fixed tenancy for 18 months as far as I remember which was then turned into a rolling or periodic one afterwards.

@franklee: That's what I'm starting to consider but that's a real bummer since the new house would give us access to a nice local school for our daughter (nicer actually than the one where she was accepted for September).