David Cameron takes hit as France and Germany agree closer EU ties

Thrugelmir

Appears as Cameron has been out manoeuvred.

Germany and France have forged a pact to integrate the eurozone without reopening the EU’s treaties, in a blow to David Cameron’s referendum campaign.

Sidestepping Britain’s demands to renegotiate the Lisbon treaty and Britain’s place in the EU, the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, and the French president, François Hollande, have sealed an agreement aimed at fashioning a tighter political union among the single-currency countries while operating within the confines of the existing treaty.

Juncker is preparing policy options for the June summit on how to integrate the eurozone fiscally and politically as it struggles to emerge from more than five years of crisis. The Franco-German proposals are likely to settle the direction of policy. They talk of economic, fiscal and social convergence, combining German insistence on monetary stability with French demands for greater investment.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/may/25/germany-france-eurozone-integration-no-lisbon-treaty-change-david-cameron

chiefie

Brinkmanship and a United show of strength ..... Before they roll over

Thrugelmir

chiefie wrote: »

Brinkmanship and a United show of strength ..... Before they roll over

A Federal Europe has always been the goal.

CLAPTON

Thrugelmir wrote: »

A Federal Europe has always been the goal.

a good thing to make clear the alternatives : federal state with one economic, social and legal system
no trial by jury of your peers,

or diversity and innovation and localism


support scottish independence and a free trade area in europe

BobQ

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Appears as Cameron has been out manoeuvred.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/may/25/germany-france-eurozone-integration-no-lisbon-treaty-change-david-cameron

Indeed.

As Harry Truman once said:"It is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who gets the credit.

Unfortunately, Cameron not only wants to change the EU but he wants everyone to know how successful he was in doing it. This attitude is simply annoys the other leaders. A more collaborative approach would work better.

CLAPTON

BobQ wrote: »

Indeed.

As Harry Truman once said:"It is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who gets the credit.

Unfortunately, Cameron not only wants to change the EU but he wants everyone to know how successful he was in doing it. This attitude is simply annoys the other leaders. A more collaborative approach would work better.

So in your opinion, the leaders of the EU are so vain and shallow , that they will be influenced by 'attitude' rather than the welfare of the people of the EU?

Who would wish to be a member?

Generali

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Appears as Cameron has been out manoeuvred.





http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/may/25/germany-france-eurozone-integration-no-lisbon-treaty-change-david-cameron

Correct me if things had changed but last time I looked into it the UK was outside the Eurozone.

I'm not sure how this means DC has been outmanoeuvred if that is still the case. Hasn't DC promised to renegotiate the UK's position in Europe, not the Eurozone's?

padington

My German colleague was saying Cameron's particularly disliked in Germany.

I would have thought a better way to play European politics is to knock back the booze and form friendships and trust, bring them into the (royal) family so to speak and become an asset to their electoral success when possible and only later talk about trouble at home and try and negotiate a big favour to keep the 'dream team' together.

As it is, it's now politically inexpedient for the European leaders to let him win any ground because of how their electorate back home feel about him.

Graham_Devon

It's a blow for Cameron's plans.

However, it's another incentive to get out of the damned project and proves what Farrage was sayign in the election completely true. Specifically in the debates he said this was happening, to the scorn of all the other parties.

.string.

Actually, from the point of negotiation of the UK place in the EU, this may not be bad news at all. It is always useful if "the other side" wants something or, in other words, concessions on both sides can be traded.

Don't forget that just as individual states can effectively veto the UK's demands, the converse is true.

So the timing of this new (?) togetherness is probably fortuitous. Conversely it may be deliberate because D & F may see the British negotiation as a means to get something they want and are prepared to trade.

So not bad news I think.

princeofpounds

As pointed out, this agreement relates to the Eurozone, not the EU. They are closely related but they are not remotely the same thing, and the topics being discussed are very much driven by the policy needs of a currency union.


There may well be some political games in the timing of the leak, but its practical impact is very limited.


The Guardian's reporting angle on this is packed full of spin, unfortunately. I suspect this is only the start of the spin wars on the topic.