Abusing paperwork such as KYC to steal your funds

jago25_98

I sent funds from my account at company A to my account at company B.

Company B requires incoming funds to be in my name, which has to match exactly. Unfortunately company A used a clearing house and as such, my name was stripped from the transaction details.
Company B is requesting the company documents for the clearing house. Obviously I cannot provide this since I don't own this company.

Something like this happened to me a few years ago when I tried to withdraw funds from an account. The institution requested a copy of my passport. They had no secure facility for me to send me them my passport. In the end I gave in and sent my passport unencrypted over email because finding a fax machine at that point was just too difficult. What would have happened if I had a typo on my birth date when I registered?

This seems to be a common thing. A company takes your funds... and then requests some kind of paperwork to release them.
Now, this paperwork may be a requirement of government... but all too often it seems like an excuse for the company to steal your funds. Never have I heard of a company returning the funds to the sender. They just sit on it. And if you can't produce whatever it is they ask for, then you lose the funds.

Another example is proof of residency. A lot of people go on gap years. Many live abroad. Some people even live with friends and family abroad for extended periods. Other don't even have paper statements anymore, following bank advice to use online only statements. So, when an institution requests proof of address which has to be a credit card statement, this request can be impossible to match. Why can't they send a card with a password? Why is it so archaic?

But the real question I am wondering here is - where do we stand legally when this happens? What is the case law?

maninthestreet

Are Company A and Company B banks???

grumbler

Sounds like some gambling websites, although it's uncommon for bookies to transfer funds and use 'clearing houses'.

All bookies say clearly that they may request proofs and what proofs.
A copy of passport isn't a top secret. Just add a watermark to it to prevent any potential misuse.

d70cw6

yeah gambling websites do this a lot. I had to edit some bank statements via MS Paint for the last lot to get them to pay out.

agrinnall

What is company B? If company A is online gambling, wouldn't company B need to be some sort of financial organisation? If so I can't see why they would insist on the transfer having to state your exact name, most will simply need sortcode and account number. It would be easier just to switch to a company C who have industry standard requirements.

jonesMUFCforever

It's exam time folks - I won't be helping OP with this!

planteria

how do mean jones, because he has made it too difficult to help?

Consumerist

planteria wrote: »

how do mean jones, because he has made it too difficult to help?

On the face of it jonesMFC has made a totally pointless post but I think the point was probably that the OP is being just a bit evasive when it come to information so that a reasonable attempt at an informative answer becomes improbable.

colsten

Consumerist wrote: »

On the face of it jonesMFC has made a totally pointless post but I think the point was probably that the OP is being just a bit evasive when it come to information so that a reasonable attempt at an informative answer becomes improbable.

Hard to see why jonesMUFCforever's post would be pointless, let alone totally pointless. His response reads more like a post from an elder forum member.

masonic

jago25_98 wrote: »

I sent funds from my account at company A to my account at company B.

Company B requires incoming funds to be in my name, which has to match exactly. Unfortunately company A used a clearing house and as such, my name was stripped from the transaction details.
Company B is requesting the company documents for the clearing house. Obviously I cannot provide this since I don't own this company.

Who are company A and company B and how did you send the funds? If company B received a bank transfer then no name would ever be associated with it. If company B received a card payment, then wouldn't it be the one using the clearing house, not company A (and if so, how could it ever verify the name of the cardholder)?

Something like this happened to me a few years ago when I tried to withdraw funds from an account. The institution requested a copy of my passport. They had no secure facility for me to send me them my passport. In the end I gave in and sent my passport unencrypted over email because finding a fax machine at that point was just too difficult. What would have happened if I had a typo on my birth date when I registered?

What if there was a mistake in the details on your passport application? What if you opened a bank account using incorrect details? You would find yourself in a difficult situation, I would suggest, so it pays to check these details very carefully.

This seems to be a common thing. A company takes your funds... and then requests some kind of paperwork to release them.
Now, this paperwork may be a requirement of government... but all too often it seems like an excuse for the company to steal your funds. Never have I heard of a company returning the funds to the sender. They just sit on it. And if you can't produce whatever it is they ask for, then you lose the funds.

So you accept there may be a requirement for these companies to establish they are handing over money to the right person and that there is no money laundering going on, but you believe they are exploiting this requirement in order to commit theft? Really?

Another example is proof of residency. A lot of people go on gap years. Many live abroad. Some people even live with friends and family abroad for extended periods. Other don't even have paper statements anymore, following bank advice to use online only statements. So, when an institution requests proof of address which has to be a credit card statement, this request can be impossible to match. Why can't they send a card with a password? Why is it so archaic?

Which companies require you to prove your address using a credit card statement, but won't accept a council tax bill, utility bill or bank statement?

How does a card with a password prove you are resident at the address, rather than using it as a forwarding address or even able to intercept mail sent to the address? It seems more likely someone paying the bills at that address is more likely to actually live there does it not?

But the real question I am wondering here is - where do we stand legally when this happens? What is the case law?

Perhaps you should ask a solicitor.

jago25_98

If I ask a solicitor I will share the result online so all know where we stand.

I've resolved my particular problem. But it's not the specifics I'm interested in.

I want to start a debate. What are our rights in these situations? If we, or a company we have used makes a mistake, do we have any rights?

Shall I share specifics? I think better not to as I notice when you do this in a thread people tend to focus on that issue. Let me know if you prefer me not to share the example so the thread remains focused. If not then I can name the companies.

edit:
Actually, let's open this debate up more.
What if your mobile phone company request paperwork you can't provide to cancel your out of term contract? Go to the Ombusman, of course. But what are your actual rights in this regard? It seems to be something more wide ranging than at first appears.