Macdonalds parking invoice

PJD

Even though I was a customer, I purchased and ate food, I was parked there for 1 hour 15 minutes, but it states that you can only park there for 1 hour... they have fined me £50 providing I pay in 2 weeks.

What is the situation now with Macdonalds - do I have to pay this, or is it still the case that this is an unenforcable invoice that I can safely ignore?

Fruitcake

PJD wrote: »

Even though I was a customer, I purchased and ate food, I was parked there for 1 hour 15 minutes, but it states that you can only park there for 1 hour... they have fined me £50 providing I pay in 2 weeks.

What is the situation now with Macdonalds - do I have to pay this, or is it still the case that this is an unenforcable invoice that I can safely ignore?

It is not a fine, it is a speculative invoice. Was this a windscreen ticket or a notice to keeper/owner (NTK) throught the post? If the former, wait for the latter. What was the name of the parking company, and what are the timescales from the alleged incident to now? (Date of incident, date of NTK.)

Assuming this was in England or Wales and the vehicle was not a hire/lease car, the advice is: -

Do not pay, do not ignore, do not reveal who was driving.

Read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES and learn how to appeal this. Also, go to Mcdonalds and ask the manager to get the ticket cancelled. Show him/her the recieps to prove you were a customer.

Appeal AND complain. Don't just rely on the manager.

Never 'phone a parking company.

The_Deep

Also, if he is unhelpful, write rude things on his facebook page,

enfield_freddy

The_Deep wrote: »

Also, if he is unhelpful, write rude things on his facebook page,

again , :j

Marktheshark

You should have asked for the Mcthroat stick.
You put the food in your mouth and then ram it down with the stick, thus avoiding getting a ticket for enjoying your food, they obviously think the food is so poor quality and quantity that one hour is more than enough to ram it down in their "restaurant" as they like to be known.

Coupon-mad

PJD wrote: »

Even though I was a customer, I purchased and ate food, I was parked there for 1 hour 15 minutes, but it states that you can only park there for 1 hour... they have fined me £50 providing I pay in 2 weeks.

What is the situation now with Macdonalds - do I have to pay this, or is it still the case that this is an unenforcable invoice that I can safely ignore?

Neither.

Please read the sticky thread for Newbies and win at POPLA. It's UKPC and they are pretty useless at POPLA evidence although they do have a witness statement from McDonalds that they sometimes trot out.

PJD

Many thanks for the replies & pointing me in right direction, answers below:

MET Parking Services

The incident happened on the 8th May, the Notice Issue Date states 13th, although it arrived to me on the 15th.

PJD

Just been reading the Parking Cowboys website and considering sending this letter, - does this seem okay?

Also I notice the the first photograph (Entry) of the car's numberplate is too dark to make out the last 2 digits. All digits can be seen clearly on the Exiting photo


Name
Address
Date

Without prejudice, except as to costs

Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper [Give its ref number]

This letter is a formal challenge to the issue of your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper as set out in the current BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice B.22

On (date) I was the registered keeper of a (make and model of vehicle) registration number (reg number).

Before I decide how to deal with your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper, I should be grateful if you would first answer all the questions and deal with all the issues I have set out below. Once you have done so, I will be able to make an informed decision on how I deal with the matter.

I should be grateful for specific answers to all questions raised. In this respect I remind you of the obligations set out in the current Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct.

I dispute your claim for the reasons set out below. Please note that although I dispute the whole basis of the parking charge, my main concern is its disproportionate and punitive level.

1. Your parking charge amount claim.

Please explain on which of the following grounds your claim is based:

(i) Damages for trespass
(ii) Damages for breach of contract
(iii) A contractual sum
2. Your loss.

If it is your case that that a trespass was committed or that a contract was breached such that your claim is one for damages; please give me a full breakdown of the actual losses which evidences that this parking charge is a true reflection of the damages caused solely by the alleged parking contravention.


3. Your status – the creditor.

Your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper simply mentions [Insert name of parking company if that is who is named on the PCN/NTK]. Please tell me who is the actual creditor making this £[insert amount] parking charge demand. I need to know exactly who is making the claim and in what capacity.

4. Ownership of premises.

Please tell me who owns the car park as I wish to send them a copy of this letter.
5. Contractual Authority (as required by BPA Ltd AOS CoP B.7)

Please provide me with a copy of the contract between your company and the landowner/landholder that provides the necessary contractual written authority for the issue and enforcement of your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper.

6. Signage.

If it is your case that a contract has been breached or that a contractual sum is now due, please send me photographs of the signs that you display and upon which you seek to evidence that a lawful and legally enforceable contract was been entered into. Please ensure that the photographs show the terms and conditions in a clear and legible manner. Please provide me with a diagram showing the locations and layout of those signs at the car park. Also provide evidence that the wording is in plain and intelligible language and in sufficiently large print as to be legible to a driver at the car park’s entry point.
7. Summary
I look forward to receiving your acknowledgement within 14 days and as there are no ‘exceptional circumstances’ your comprehensive reply within 35 days (in accordance with the BPA AOS Code of Practice B.22.8). I will then be able to make an informed decision as to how I deal with your Parking Charge Notice – Notice to Keeper.
If you reject this challenge or fail to address the issues that have been raised then, in accordance with the BPA AOS Code of Practice 22.12, please ensure that you enclose all the required information (including the necessary ‘POPLA code’) so that I may immediately refer the matter for their decision.
If you fail to follow any of the procedures outlined in the BPA AOS Code of Practice or your legal requirements under the Protection of Freedoms Act, or the requirements of the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct then I will make a formal complaint to the DVLA Data Sharing Policy Group, D16.
Please Note: Unless you have specifically requested it and received my express permission, you do not have my authority to disclose or refer this letter or any other communication from me to any other person or organisation.
Yours

Umkomaas

Without prejudice, except as to costs

I take it you understand what this means?

You are just asking them a series of questions, which there is no requirement on them to answer, so you won't get a reply. All you're doing is eating into the 28 days they are giving you to submit your appeal. This isn't an appeal.

And once those 28 days have elapsed you'll have an uphill struggle in getting any POPLA code out of them.

Have you read the NEWBIES sticky as advised by Fruitcake in post #2? Because there's a tried and tested, made for purpose, initial appeal right there in post #1.

Why do you think the Parking Cowboys' version is more appropriate/better?

PJD

Thanks for your reply. I was reading the huge sticky you refer to, and it states "There are useful websites with advice, such as Parking Cowboys:
http://www.parkingcowboys.co.uk/" - - I then found a case of someone who parked in the exact same Macdonalds and used that sample letter
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5054918

I have rang Macdonalds branch, and they told me to ring customer services, of which I did, - I have given them all the details, and they said that they are going to get a guy who deals with Macdonalds parking tickets to give me a call back (but they couldnt guarentee that that would be today, and time is ticking by)

I will re-read the sticky again, but I must say I am getting a little confused (it's not difficult)

PJD

Okay, so shall I send this?

Recorded?


The only point I am unsure of is that the signage was ambiguous comment, - as I cannot read the signage again as it is not local to me



Date


Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. ....................

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car, on these main grounds:

a). The sum does not represent a genuine pre-estimate of loss, nor is it a core price term. It is extravagant and unconscionable when compared to local parking charges issued by the Council so cannot be justified.
b). As keeper I believe that the signs were not seen, the wording is ambiguous and the predominant purpose of your business model is to deter.
c). There is no evidence that you have any proprietary interest in the land.
d). Your 'Notice' fails to comply with the POFA 2012 and breaches various consumer contract/unfair terms Regulations.
e). There was no consideration nor acceptance flowing from both parties and any contract with myself, or the driver, is denied.

Your clients should be thoroughly ashamed of the shoddy way you treat consumers visiting their premises. Parking firms like yours fail to demonstrate even a basic understanding of customer service. The reputation of your business model appears to be more akin to a protection racket than 'parking management'. The public have no faith in the private parking industry and, as far as I have seen, your firm has not shown itself to be any different than the ex-clampers with whom you share a membership.

The purpose of this communication is:

1. Formal challenge
There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. As such, you must either rely on the POFA 2012 or cancel the charge. I suggest you uphold this challenge now or alternatively, send a rejection letter.

2. ''Drop hands'' offer
The extravagant 'parking charge' is baseless but I realise that you may have incurred nominal postage costs. Equally, I have incurred costs to date, for responding to your junk mail dressed up to impersonate a parking ticket. It is clear that my costs and yours, at this point, do not exceed £15. Therefore, this is a formal “drop hands” offer. I remind you of the duty to mitigate any loss, so withdraw the spurious charge within 35 days without further expense and I will not pursue you for my costs. If you persist then I will charge in full for my time at £18 per hour plus my out-of-pocket expenses and damages for harassment.

3. Notice of cancellation of contract
I hereby give notice of withdrawal from this alleged 'contract' which was never properly offered by you and certainly was not expressly agreed. This 'contract' is hereby cancelled and any obligations now end. If you offer - and if I decide to use - IAS or POPLA, then the contract ends immediately on the date of their decision (whatever the outcome) so my notice of cancellation still applies. The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation & Additional Payments) Regulations apply now to every consumer contract, save for a few exemptions, which parking contracts are not. Following the EU Consumer Rights Directive, express consent must be obtained for consumer contracts now - not implied consent. You have failed to meet these requirements and you did not serve the driver with the terms by durable medium.

By replying to the challenge you are acknowledging receipt and acceptance of points 2 and 3 above.

I have kept proof of submission of this challenge. I look forward to your considered reply within 35 days.

Yours faithfully,