Divorce lawyers process and fees - advice needed please!

fluffpot

Hi everyone

Hope this is the right forum. I'll try and keep it brief.

A very good friend of mine is currently trying to get divorced. She told me last night that so far she had spent over £40K on lawyers fees and is still no further forward.
She has now run out of money and asked the lawyers to stop work about 2 weeks ago. She just just received a further bill for a couple of grand. I told her not to pay it.

I don't know the first thing about divorce or the legalities, but this doesn't seem right to me.

As I understand it, the divorce papers have been served, and the lawyers have been trying to get financial information from her husband (there are kids involved, he's a high earner), but he won't respond - so they keep chasing and then keep billing her.

Is there anything that can be done? She said they'd advised her not to go to court as 'it could cost thousands'. My take is, it's already cost thousands and she's no further on!

Can her husband be taken to court to make him provide the info?
Have the lawyers acted in her best interests? And if no, what can me done?
If she needs to take legal advice, who can provide this? Can CAB help?

Sorry for all the questions - I'm very worried about my friend and want to make sure she's getting the best advice for her and the kids

thanks

TBagpuss

The actual divorce itself is normally the simple part. Sorting out issues relating to finances and children can become very expensive, particularly if the other party is obstructive.
It can often be appropriate to delay finalising the divorce until financial issues are resolved in order to protect any potential widows benefits.

When your friend first instructed her solicitors they should have provided her with a client care letter including details of the estimated costs, and how they would be worked out (i.e. the hourly rate of the person doing the work)

If that estimate changed then they should have informed her.
So her first step needs to be to check what estimate she was given at the outset and what costs updates she has been given since. If she has not been provided with adequate costs information she may be able to make a complaint.

Going to court is expensive. Typically it costs more than resolving matters by negotiation, but obviously that depends on whether the other party is willing to negotiate - there is a judgement call about whether / when to apply to court.

£40K is a lot - what hourly rate is she paying? It does however depend on how complex the issues are and how awkward her husband is - also on whether that is all legal costs or whether there are also costs for other experts such as a pensions actuary, valuers for any companies owned etc etc

What instructions has she been giving? I ask because in my experience, it is fairly common for people to complain nothing is happening and/or that their costs are higher than they expected, and for it to be that they have been very indecisive, have not provided information or documents, or have been unwilling to follow the advice they have been given. I am not saying that that is necessarily the case for your friend, but solicitors in family cases charge based on the work they do, not on the outcome, so if your friend has changed her mind about what she wants, then she will still have been charged for the work done before she changed her mind. Similarly, if her ex is being very awkward, she will be charged for the extra chasing and following up that may require, even if it has not achieved the outcome she wanted,. as her solicitor will have still spent that time. Similarly if she needs alots of reassurance and therefore has lots of meetings with the solicitor, or is phoning or writing to them a lot, this will push up the costs.

Do the bills she has been setting set out what work has been done? Has she queried any of them before now?

If she feels that trying to negotiate is getting her nowhere then she can instruct the solicitors to issue court proceedings on the finances, which will set a time table.

if she has lost confidence in these solicitors then she could move to a different firm, but she will have to pay the current firm's final bill first.

Finst

By the time its finished, my divorce will have probably cost around 15k in legal fees. That was with 3 attempts by the other side to renegotiate the initial settlement and one house to change ownership over but no children, and no going to court.

40k does seems high given the level of progress made

fluffpot

thank you both so much for the replies.
She is in London, so I guess prices are higher....

I will gently ask about how the solicitors were instructed and maybe try and get sight of the client care letter.

All the obstructions have been on her husbands side (without going into it, he's got issues and is very erratic/unreliable) - I understand that a lot of the costs have been in trying to get info from him. She has been doing everything she can to progress things and responding as quickly as she can (while holding down a full time job, moving and looking after 2 kids under 10). I don't think she's got time for long meetings/calls with the solicitors (this might be a good and a bad thing I guess!)

There are no companies involved, but a house with a mortgage (currently empty, but she is trying to let it to help cover the payments). As she still has no info on his financials, I can't see how they can have spent out on actuaries, yet! I'm concerned as he is spending money like crazy and she's scrimping and worrying about being able to meet rent and mortgage payments each month....

My husband mentioned something about going to courts to get the financial info - so interesting that you mention this. Is it expensive? I would happily pay the costs of this for her if it would help get over this impasse. I think it's highly unlikely her husband will attend court at the present time.

Thanks once again for the information - extremely helpful

Edit: I should have said that she's in London but he's in north of the border if this makes a difference

Caroline_a

Has she applied to the CSA for maintenance for her children? There is a small cost for that now, but if he is obstructive they have the ability to get money deducted from his salary before he receives it.

More info here CSA

fluffpot

Caroline
Thanks for that - I'll look into it for her. Sadly though I don't think he's going to have a job for much longer.

TBagpuss

If she applies to court for a financial settlement, then the court automatically sets a timetable, requiring both parties to provide financial information (completing a Form E financial statement).

If her husband ignores this or fails to go to court then she may be able to ask the Judge to order that he pa her 'wasted costs' (i.e. the costs of her showing up at court and making no progress because he h has not complied with the order)

If she is struggling and he is a high earner another possibility might be to apply for Maintenance Pending Suit, which essentially is asking the court to order him to pay her maintenance to keep her going (potentially including covering legal costs) until a final settlement is reached.

If there is an empty house with a mortgage to pay she may be better off moving back in (and then considering renting out a room if need be)

fluffpot

TBagpuss

Wow - thanks for that. It now looks like she has options, which is a relief. What I don't understand is why her current solicitors have not suggested any of this (come on, you don't think they are just in it for themselves do you?!?!)

Sadly the house is hundreds of miles away from her job and kids schools in London, so moving is not an option. Long story, but that's the outcome.

alb1

In addition to what TBagpuss has said, if she suspects something fishy is going on with her solicitor's charges she has the right to have her own solicitor's Bill assessed by a Court. There are risks in doing this as she may have to pay the solicitor's costs of the Court assessment if the Bill is not reduced by 20%, and she may be barred from seeking an assessment in certain circumstances, but it's something to look into if she's not happy with the charges. A Costs Lawyer would be able to help and advise on whether it's worth doing.

fluffpot

Hi everyone

Me again with a bit of an update.

I have now seen some of the solicitors letters, cost estimates and invoices. The key person's fees are almost £300 p/h plus VAT.

What I hadn't realised was that because the husband refuses to speak to my friend, ALL communication was going through the solicitors. This related mainly to arrangements for the children over Christmas, new year, half term, Easter etc. Down to the times of the buses and pick up points! I guess that this also means the husband has incurred similar solicitors costs. (so £80K in total, gulp!)

There are 2 estimates - one for the divorce - upper limit estimated @ £3k.
The other for the Children's arrangements upper limit estimate at @ £45K. However, this is set out over several headings, which don't mean much to me, so I'd welcome any advice
1. Mediation route
2. Proceedings from issue - compromised
3, Proceedings from issue to final hearing
4. Post trial work

What do these mean? I think I need to find out if they have actually achieved any of them for their £40K.
In several of the letters the solicitor says that they are worried about costs escalating and that the mediation route would be more cost effective. But it was never pursued.

As far as I can tell, the work they've done for the children's arrangements only covers the very short term (ie from when it started to now) and not longer term agreements.

Really should solicitors at £300p/h be dealing with minutiae of half term visits?

My friend has now told the solicitors to stop work as there is no more money - they tried to bill her for more stuff, but have relented on this and taken some off the bill.

Any thoughts most welcome.

So far the husband has been making a monthly payment to cover most of the rent for the family home, but we are both worried that this could stop at any time if he gets sacked. The only agreement for this is via a text

thanks again for your time and input

Fluff