The MSE Debate House Prices Manifesto

cells

michaels wrote: »

Perhaps we should build double story basements under every existing property but have them as seperate dwellings, we could use 75 inch TVs to give the ilusion of windows, pump in some fresh air and use as social housing...for the underclasses

I'll get me coat.

One floor up and one floor down should be permitted development in the majority of London

Also rear half basement extensions should be PD. So a lower ground floor and an upper one

padington

One thing I would do is create a children's pension fund which requires by law children to pay in a percentage of pocket money and teenager Saturday job money, albeit on a trust basis but with a minimum requirement.

I would hope it teaches children in a real way about the power of compound interest and gives the future generations an extra pension fund which because of being started so early, may actually at the end be something not to be sniffed at.

CLAPTON

padington wrote: »

One thing I would do is create a children's pension fund which requires by law children to pay in a percentage of pocket money and teenager Saturday job money, albeit on a trust basis but with a minimum requirement.

I would hope it teaches children in a real way about the power of compound interest and gives the future generations an extra pension fund which because of being started so early, may actually at the end be something not to be sniffed at.

sometimes it is difficult to distinguish between ironic humour and ignorant stupidity or simply a lack of knowledge of economics

padington

CLAPTON wrote: »

sometimes it is difficult to distinguish between ironic humour and ignorant stupidity or simply a lack of knowledge of economics

Why do you say that ?

antrobus

CLAPTON wrote: »

...a basis citizens income is a way of avoiding high marginal rates of deduction the objection is that if set low then it's ineffective and if set high removes the incentive to work at all for many people...

The practical objections to a basic citizens income would include;

- no matter how you cut the cake, it involves people who work paying more tax in order to fund payments to people who don't work

- given what EU law has to say about the rights of EU citizens, it is difficult to see how it could be structured in such a way as to deny payment to every unemployed Greek or whatever who decided to relocate themselves to the UK

CLAPTON

padington wrote: »

Why do you say that ?

Unless you envisage making a store of goods (e.. stock pile baked beans like Maggie)
then the goods and services consumed in 40-60 years time will have to produced at that time.

So give or take an import or two, the only goods and services we can consume in 40 years time will depend upon what we can produce.
Any pensions saving will, depending upon the circumstances at the time, only help determine the distribution of those goods and service amoungst the population at that time.


So you building up a store of saving for your children (like any unearned income ) will indeed help them but only at the cost of some-one else going without.

michaels

CLAPTON wrote: »

Unless you envisage making a store of goods (e.. stock pile baked beans like Maggie)
then the goods and services consumed in 40-60 years time will have to produced at that time.

So give or take an import or two, the only goods and services we can consume in 40 years time will depend upon what we can produce.
Any pensions saving will, depending upon the circumstances at the time, only help determine the distribution of those goods and service amoungst the population at that time.


So you building up a store of saving for your children (like any unearned income ) will indeed help them but only at the cost of some-one else going without.

Not entirely true, you could spend your effort now on investment goods that will provide a service in the future - an extreme example, paying for a carer now that you will need in 30 years time is off little use, but paying to have a carer robot built now that will do the caring in 30 years time when there may be less labour availabel will give you the service when you want it.

cells

Labour won't be a problem the average age of entering the workforce is probably 20 which can be moved back by 3 years adding some 2.5 million to the workforce.

Also that is considerably more effective than the same number of immigrants as immigrants add supply but also add demand and the two largely cancle out.

CLAPTON

michaels wrote: »

Not entirely true, you could spend your effort now on investment goods that will provide a service in the future - an extreme example, paying for a carer now that you will need in 30 years time is off little use, but paying to have a carer robot built now that will do the caring in 30 years time when there may be less labour availabel will give you the service when you want it.

Real investment is about delaying consumption now to build mechanisms to allow greater consumption in the future.

We do that all the time and it is why we all are so rich.

However, real investment is not brought about by creating a pension.
It may be that pension money either directly or indirectly contributes to producing investment goods but that is not the primary purpose and probably is less effective than other procedures.

The point I wish to make is that the goods and services consumed in 40 years time will be those produced in contemporaneous time frame : using, of course, all the investment goods we have at that time.

The exist of a pension funds at that time don't contribute to the total volume of goods and services although an individual can get a greater share using their pension 'money'.

Generali

The logical position of all political parties bar UKIP if carried through for term after term is that all of Government spending ends up being pensions, the NHS and aged care.