Has Capitalism Met the Marxist Utopia?

antrobus

padington wrote: »

... And in the same breath no country is 100% capitalist. X

Every country in the world is 100% capitalist. The only distinction is whether or not they are 'free enterprise' capitalist, or state capitalist.

P.S. Or maybe 99% of the world is capitalist. I can't exclude the possibility that there isn't the odd bit of feudalism still hanging around.:)

Cornucopia

antrobus wrote: »

Err. Shouldn't you therefore be starting off the process, by providing some "proper analysis and references" for your "fact".

I've already given an analysis.

Here is a reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed_economy

antrobus

Cornucopia wrote: »

I've already given an analysis.

Here is a reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed_economy

Wikipedia is not considered a credible source
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Academic_use

Cornucopia

I'm not going to go trawling the web for something that is readable, when Wiki is adequate for our purposes.

This is a money-saving forum, not academic research.

If you have a factual issue with anything in the Wiki article, by all means state your objections. For someone trying to arrange an orderly discussion, you aren't doing much discussing.

antrobus

Besides which your proposition is simply wrong.

Countries only have a 'mixed economy' in the sense that they are mixture of free enterprise and state capitalism. None of them incude much in the way of Marxist socialism.

Note that the subject of this thread is the Marxist Utopia (as in "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need") and not anybody else's utopia, so it is the Marxist defintion that matters.

Cornucopia

Right, and that phrase was the founding principle of the UK Welfare State.

I don't accept that the NHS is not a fundamentally Socialist organisation, at least in terms of its broad remit at its inception.

We can argue about if/whether/when it lost its way, but it's pretty clear what it was about when it started.

antrobus

Cornucopia wrote: »

Right, and that phrase was the founding principle of the UK Welfare State.....

No it wasn't. Beveridge had three guiding principles in his report on Social Insurance and Allied Services. That was not one of them.

Cornucopia wrote: »

...I don't accept that the NHS is not a fundamentally Socialist organisation, at least in terms of its broad remit at its inception.

We can argue about if/whether/when it lost its way, but it's pretty clear what it was about when it started.

It is not socialist under any Marxist defintion, and it is the Marxist Utopia that is the subject of this thread.

mumps

CLAPTON wrote: »

the tax payer trains and educates most people for most careers (all except the much praised privately educated)

there is no terrible shortage of nurses : where did you hear that from?

Several quotes on local tv about hospitals being on red alert or black or something denoting crisis and having to bring in nurses from abroad as there is a crisis. I haven't actually been round and done a survey so just taking BBC word for it.

Most students at uni now are paying £9 a year, nurses pay nothing and get a bursary so I think it is reasonable for the NHS to get something back.

padington

Has capitalism met the Marxist utopia ?

No, no one would be silly enough run a pure capatalist country but many liberal democratic mixed economies may have met a fairly utopian extintance for many of its people.

The key word is liberal.

CLAPTON

mumps wrote: »

Several quotes on local tv about hospitals being on red alert or black or something denoting crisis and having to bring in nurses from abroad as there is a crisis. I haven't actually been round and done a survey so just taking BBC word for it.

Most students at uni now are paying £9 a year, nurses pay nothing and get a bursary so I think it is reasonable for the NHS to get something back.

you mustn't confuse the lack of nurses and our unwillingness or inability to pay for them.