Employer won't allow me to claim fuel back from HMRC

CLAPTON

fletchie wrote: »

Sorry if I'm being completely thick here, but I don't understand what you mean. My understanding is that if I've been paid a pence per mile which is lower than the HMRC rates then I can submit a claim on form P87 to get the unused balance/the difference of the approved amount. Is this not correct? Perhaps it's my terminology that has caused confusion.

Hope you don't think I'm being rude but I'd rather not publish my car allowance or tax code online (worried of repercussions if my employer saw this) but I'm a lower rate taxpayer.

business expenses are not paid by the tax payer.
however business expenses can be offset against profits and hence against tax

so lets take an example
10,000 business miles re-imbursed at 12+2 pence per mile = 14 ppm

so HMRC will allow 45ppm for the first 10,000

so allowance is 10,000 x (45-14)=10,000 x 31p = £3100

so tax back will be 3100 X 20% = £620 for the 10,000 business miles.


my point about the car allowance is that maybe it is reasonably generous and your employer may feel they are adequately compensating you for the use of your car.

quietriot

You're allowed up to 45p per mile mileage to be paid tax-free.
Your employer pays you 14p per mile in total, presumably tax-free.
HMRC will look at that and see that you should have had 31p per mile tax free.
They DON'T give you the 31p. They say that you've received the 31p elsewhere in your income, but have paid tax on it.
They then refund you the tax, which would be 20%. Your refund would therefore be equivalent to 6.2p per mile.

Normally, you'd claim this on a P87 form or self-assessment at the end of the tax year.
If your employer's in the MARORS scheme, then they'll submitdetails to HMRC of how many miles you did, and HMRC will calculate your refund without need for a claim.
If your employer's not in the MARORS scheme then there's potentially something dodgy going on and you'll need to investigate further, or phone HMRC and get them to do it.

Edit: goddammit, beaten.

Muttonchops_1943

CLAPTON wrote: »

business expenses are not paid by the tax payer.
however business expenses can be offset against profits and hence against tax

so lets take an example
10,000 business miles re-imbursed at 12+2 pence per mile = 14 ppm

so HMRC will allow 45ppm for the first 10,000

so allowance is 10,000 x (45-14)=10,000 x 31p = £3100

so tax back will be 3100 X 20% = £620 for the 10,000 business miles.

my point about the car allowance is that maybe it is reasonably generous and your employer may feel they are adequately compensating you for the use of your car.

My car allowance has been actually reduced by £80 a month after the old car scheme changed. We are now paid according to the car Co2 emissions. It's not a fantastic amount and given the company pay us a pence per mile rate based on company car rates which we don't even have, it's no wonder we are confused!

frisbeej

Does the monthly car allowance restrict the amount that can be claimed per mile? So the 12p is purely for fuel costs, the monthly allowance for everything else.


So glad I don't have to drive my own car for work. Never mind that I never drive anywhere for work in the UK and I don't actually have a car.

Muttonchops_1943

quietriot wrote: »

You're allowed up to 45p per mile mileage to be paid tax-free.
Your employer pays you 14p per mile in total, presumably tax-free.
HMRC will look at that and see that you should have had 31p per mile tax free.
They DON'T give you the 31p. They say that you've received the 31p elsewhere in your income, but have paid tax on it.
They then refund you the tax, which would be 20%. Your refund would therefore be equivalent to 6.2p per mile.

Normally, you'd claim this on a P87 form or self-assessment at the end of the tax year.
If your employer's in the MARORS scheme, then they'll submitdetails to HMRC of how many miles you did, and HMRC will calculate your refund without need for a claim.
If your employer's not in the MARORS scheme then there's potentially something dodgy going on and you'll need to investigate further, or phone HMRC and get them to do it.

Edit: goddammit, beaten.

Ok, a form p87 it is then. Out of curiosity, if I was successful in getting tax relief back, does that mean the company can't be in the MAROS scheme? I assume HMRC would check my claim against what my company have submitted? I would rather hope there is nothing dodgy going on? Other than this thorny issue, they are an excellent employer.

Muttonchops_1943

frisbeej wrote: »

Does the monthly car allowance restrict the amount that can be claimed per mile? So the 12p is purely for fuel costs, the monthly allowance for everything else.


So glad I don't have to drive my own car for work. Never mind that I never drive anywhere for work in the UK and I don't actually have a car.

No idea, would have to check this. That is probably how they get us. We used to have a very generous car allowance scheme and fuel cards, both have been cut.

booksurr

fletchie wrote: »

No idea, would have to check this. That is probably how they get us. We used to have a very generous car allowance scheme and fuel cards, both have been cut.

a "car" allowance is totally independent of any mileage rate. The allowance is simply extra taxable income and as stated before is the same as a pay rise. Whether you do, or do not, get a "car" allowance does not affect your entitlement to the 45/25 ppm rate on business miles driven.

clearly your company has cut its costs by reducing both your "car" allowance and the mileage rate. That obviously is an industrial relations problem should you wish to tackle it.

Their instruction that you "cannot" claim the extra tax relief on the "missing" 31ppm is however a different matter which, at the moment, appears either a fact of their MAROS membership which you have not had confirmed, or it is simply wrong and none of their business.

Muttonchops_1943

booksurr wrote: »

a "car" allowance is totally independent of any mileage rate. The allowance is simply extra taxable income and as stated before is the same as a pay rise. Whether you do, or do not, get a "car" allowance does not affect your entitlement to the 45/25 ppm rate on business miles driven.

clearly your company has cut its costs by reducing both your "car" allowance and the mileage rate. That obviously is an industrial relations problem should you wish to tackle it.

Their instruction that you "cannot" claim the extra tax relief on the "missing" 31ppm is however a different matter which, at the moment, appears either a fact of their MAROS membership which you have not had confirmed, or it is simply wrong and none of their business.

I've downloaded the form from HMRC and will complete and send off. I'm not going to inform my employer about it, I don't see that it's any of their business if I query my own tax affairs. Thanks for the help and advice given, it's not easy to understand if you're a novice but I think I understand it slightly more than I did yesterday! Wish me luck.

suso

One thing to consider,

If you submit a P87 claim for last year, HMRC will consider that the circumstances are the same for this year, they will issue a refund for last year directly to you, (no employer involvement), but they will change your code for this year as well.

Although your employer will not be told why the code has changed. You never know if a clerk in the payroll department is going to pass on the info that your code has suddenly jumped up.

The best thing to do is to enclose a letter with the P87 saying this was a one off claim and you are not expecting to claim this year and you don't want your code changed.

Don't worry about the claim for this year, circumstances always change and we're only 13 days into the new tax year.

RavingMad

Hi, jumping on this thread somewhat..

I've been driving a company car, which I pay tax on and for the last couple of years, due to tupe, I've lost my fuel card and had to pay for all the fuel. The company pay me 14p per business mile

Is there any entitlement in this scenario?