PoFA Requirements met...

Pu5hkin

Hello - I am a newbie and thank you so much for all the collective wisdom here!

I ignored my PCN from UKCPS (and another from PE, so I'm bracing myself for that fall out too! ) and now have the LBCCC from UKCPS in my possession.

The original notice was to keeper/driver and detailed PoFA sections 8.e(2) and 8.f(1)(2). So having hoped to issue a full written response proceeding along the lines of 'Reset the Clock' and submit the driver information, I am no longer convinced this is the right course of action as it seems they have a solid case to pursue the claim with me.

Should I try responding to the LBCCC with the driver details, or should I try going for a fight back using the Practice Directions?

Thanks for your help.

Half_way

read this then reply with more questions etc https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822

Pu5hkin

Thank you Half_Way. I think although UKCPS have quoted the relevant bits of PoFA, they were trying to use it against me to say that I was out of time pass on the driver details and so I have already accepted liability. I understand from following the links you posted that PoFA does not say that all - I can pass on driver information at any point. I will try this and revisit your response for any next steps. :-)

The_Deep

Did UKCPS claim it was a contractual charge? If so, did they account for v.a.t.? If not, why not?

Further reading here.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...7925&highlight=

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...3796&highlight=

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...5195437&page=4

Pu5hkin

VAT was not mentioned in the 'invoice'. Is your thought that this could form the basis of the 'full written response' to the LBCCC or that it could be relevant for an appeal/POPLA if that option could be reopened with the driver?

Umkomaas

UKCPS normally issue windscreen tickets (Notice to Driver -NtD) - if this is the case in your parking incident, I'm afraid 'naming the driver' is not an option, the driver had his/her opportunity on receipt of the NtD.

POPLA is probably not an option either (depending on date of the parking incident) as UKCPS are now IPC AOS members and any appeal would have to be to the IPC IAS.

Pu5hkin

Thanks Umkomaas. Luckily no windscreen ticket was issued. Neither was one issued for the PE ticket which I am expecting to need to follow suit with in due course.

I'm trying for the letter naming the driver option to 'reset the clock', but I'm not setting my letter out as a 'full written response' to the LBCCC. I hope this is the right format to take.

bod1467

Do UKCPS allege that a windscreen ticket was issued?
Was the NtK issued within 14 days of the "offence"?

Umkomaas

bod1467 wrote: »

Do UKCPS allege that a windscreen ticket was issued?
Was the NtK issued within 14 days of the "offence"?

+1 ^^

In respect of PE, don't let that situation reach the point where you are served court papers (which they confetti out daily) at which point it will be too late to name the driver.

There will be no letter from either PPC (other than the NtK) specifically giving you a 'reset the clock by naming the driver' option.

The_Deep

UKCPS allege that they do not pay vat/there asr not registered, and many of us on here are struggling to understand why.

If UKCPS are claiming that you agreed contractually to pay their excess charge, then, as a fee, it is vattable, whereas liquidated damages for Breach of contract are not.

With a contractual charge, they do not have to account for losses, (GPEOL), with damages for breach, they do, and that is a mountain for them to climb.

If they are not charging v.a.t. they are either not liable, or evading tax.

You rally need to read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5195437=

They will argue that they do not have to account for their losses as you agreed to the contract when you parked. You therefore can ask them for vat compliant paperwork. If they do not produce it you can argue in court that the claim is in fact a penalty.

It might not be a clincher, but as Tesco tell us, "every little helps".

Castle

The_Deep wrote: »

UKCPS allege that they do not pay vat/there asr not registered, and many of us on here are struggling to understand why.

The only way they could avoid VAT would be to issue PCN's for damages in their own name (i.e as principal). This is what was decided eventually in HMRC v VCS; but that related to private land rather than a retail park for example. Of course if they don't have to charge VAT, then they can't claim it back on all the equipment they buy.

If they are acting as an Agent then they will have to charge VAT on the services they provide to the Principal irrespective of whether the PCN is a fee or damages.