MSE News: Single parents sent 'threatening' letters demanding proof they live alone

MissMoneypenny

Housing_Benefit_Officer wrote: »

Most Local Authorities are using the same sort of thing using private companies to successfully uncover Council Tax Single Person Discount fraud.

This is nothing new -

It certainly isn't. I don't know what all this fuss is about.
About 10 years ago I received a letter from the council about Council Tax Single Person Discount which stated that they had evidence that another person was at my address. All I had do was contact them and let them know the person was my student son who was away at university. Their own student records confirmed that, which saved me having to send them proof.

Strangely, they didn't pick up on my student daughter who was also away at university. Perhaps because she was female?

Councils' have a duty to UK taxpayers' to ensure that Council Tax Single Person Discount claims are correct. All the various benefits offices also have this same duty. Just accept this check for what it is. It's nothing to get emotional about if you haven't committed fraud.

FBaby

I find the idea that these checks will result in many fraud cases, ridiculous. The report issued by the Office Of National Statistics on a previous investigation blitz shows few fraud cases.

No it isn't new at all, HMRC have done lots of these investigations over the last couple of years. More are being done as they have more people doing them. The Concentrix approach is exactly the same as the HMRC one and is covered by the same legislative powers. The letters are pretty much identical.

Surely if they are continuing to do check and upping the staff to do more, it is because the resulting outcome has been that fraud doesn't take place?

I really can't see the logic in continuing to do something costly when previous such exercises have shown that there are a waste of time and resources.

Icequeen99

FBaby wrote: »

Surely if they are continuing to do check and upping the staff to do more, it is because the resulting outcome has been that fraud doesn't take place?

I really can't see the logic in continuing to do something costly when previous such exercises have shown that there are a waste of time and resources.

They are doing it in HMRC because previous exercises have found lots of incorrect claims. Very few are because of fraud, most are classed as error.

IQ

GirlFromMars_2

In these days of scams and identity theft wouldn't anyone else find it suspicious that the letters are coming from a private company instead of HMRC?

I don't claim Working Tax Credits, but if the DWP or Local Authority asked for evidence regarding my claims I'd be happy to supply it. But if a third party sent a letter out of the blue, I'd be really suspicious, and given the amount of original evidence they request I'd be very reluctant to send it.

I would be really interested to know what the Data Protection clauses are, for use of this data by the third party.

And if I were in this situation I'd be interested to know if I could supply the information direct to HMRC instead of going through an unknown third party who had written to me out of the blue.

FBaby

Icequeen99 wrote: »

They are doing it in HMRC because previous exercises have found lots of incorrect claims. Very few are because of fraud, most are classed as error.

IQ

Either way, it's got to be about savings so if this exercise identifies some, then it has to be worthwhile one.

MissMoneypenny

GirlFromMars wrote: »

In these days of scams and identity theft wouldn't anyone else find it suspicious that the letters are coming from a private company instead of HMRC?

You could phone HMRC and ask. Google it. I'm sure this isn't the only thread about this on the internet. A quick internet search brought up this from the gov.uk site
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/genuine-hmrc-contact-and-recognising-phishing-emails/genuine-hmrc-contact-and-recognising-phishing-emails

"From November 2014, a company called Concentrix will be working on behalf of HMRC to check that people are receiving the correct amount of tax credits.

Some tax credits customers will receive a letter that shows both HMRC and Concentrix logos. The letter will tell customers what they need to do, and the information they may need to provide. Concentrix may also contact customers by telephone.

HMRC and Concentrix won’t ask customers to disclose any personal or payment information by text or email. Both HMRC and Concentrix are committed to ensuring the security of customer information."

GirlFromMars wrote: »

I don't claim Working Tax Credits, but if the DWP or Local Authority asked for evidence regarding my claims I'd be happy to supply it. But if a third party sent a letter out of the blue, I'd be really suspicious, and given the amount of original evidence they request I'd be very reluctant to send it.

If you ignored their request, then I assume your benefits would cease.

GirlFromMars wrote: »

I would be really interested to know what the Data Protection clauses are, for use of this data by the third party.

I believe that a few years ago, private companies were sorting the benefits claims for the sick or disabled. There is no difference between a state worker checking your claim and someone who works for a company that has been given the contract to do this by the government, checking your claim. Staff working for other organisations can see your private information too ie Bank staff.

GirlFromMars wrote: »

And if I were in this situation I'd be interested to know if I could supply the information direct to HMRC instead of going through an unknown third party who had written to me out of the blue.

I assume that if the correct place didn't receive your required evidence in time, then your claim would stop? Do you trust HMRC staff to look at your letter and forward this to the correct place in time? Even your signed for package would show a different address to the place you were told to send everything too.

benniebert

Shame that they haven't got round to questioning my neighbour who has 4 kids by 4 different blokes, claims IS, HB, CTS, Tax Credits etc etc purporting to be a single mum! Has her latest beau (father of the 4th kid) living with her and he tells those that will listen that he is now earning enough to get a mortgage of £200,000+. Makes you sick.

Poppie68

benniebert wrote: »

Shame that they haven't got round to questioning my neighbour who has 4 kids by 4 different blokes, claims IS, HB, CTS, Tax Credits etc etc purporting to be a single mum! Has her latest beau (father of the 4th kid) living with her and he tells those that will listen that he is now earning enough to get a mortgage of £200,000+. Makes you sick.

If you are sure she's committing benefit fraud why haven't you reported her?

nicki_2

I'm not prepared to post an image of my letter as I have notes and personal information on it obviously, but I am happy to type it out for you. Bits in bold are in bold on the letter. My letter, dated 27th Jan, says:

Dear XXXXXX

We need to talk to you about whether you are living with a partner

You claim tax credits as a single person, but we have evidence that there may be another adult living with you. If you're married, in a civil partnership, or usually live with a partner, you must make a joint claim unless you are legally separated, or your separation is likely to be permanent. You have been contacted by Concentrix because we are working on behalf of HMRC.

We need you to phone us on 0345 6003130 so we can talk about your circumstances. If you don't phone us, we need you to post us the evidence we ask for below. If we do not hear fro you by 26 Feb 2015, we will stop your tax credit payments. We may also change any previous award you have had.

We hope that you cooperate fully with our check and help us to work out how much tax credits you are due. You may wish to get help from a professional adviser. If you do not cooperate with us, we may reduce or stop your tac credits payment.

If:
- you have given us wrong information or made an error, we will consider charging you a penalty - see the enclosed leaflet 'Tax credits penalties'
- We have paid you too much tax credits, you will have to pay this back to us.

If there is anything you want us to take into account when we consider whether to charge you a penalty, please tell us as soon as possible.

What you need to do
By 26 Feb 2015, please phone us on 0345 6003130 so we can discuss your circumstances and decide whether you should be making a single or joint claim. During this call we may ask you for different evidence to that listed below please provide us with any evidence we ask for at that time. If you don't call us you need to send the following for the period 06 Apr 2014 to 27 Jan 2015 to support your reasons for making a single claim:
- statements from all your bank and building society accounts (including any joint accounts)
- your mortgage statement or a copy of your rental agreement if you rent your home
- your council tax bills or rate if you live in Northern Ireland
- your gas, electricity, water and telephone bills
- any court or solicitor letters including legal separation documents, degree nisi, absolute or dissolution
- any information relating to maintenance or Child Support Agency payments
- any benefit letters (for example Housing Benefit, Income Support)
- any other information to explain why you have claimed as a single person.

Please make sure you send us original documents, not copies. We will send these original documents back to you. If we believe that any documents you send to us are not genuine or that you are not the holder, we may keep them.

We will be unable to discuss any decisions on your award until we have received the information we have asked for.

You need to send this information to the address shown at the top of this letter.

Please read the enclosed fact sheet 'WTC/FS2 Tax Credits examinations'. This tells you more about why we check awards and what your rights are.

What happens if we have paid you too much tax credits
If we have paid you too much tax credits as a single person and you decide to make a new joint claim, we may work out how much tax credits we would have paid if you had made a joint claim on time. We may then take off that amount from any overpayment you have on your single award. The longer we pay you a wrong award, the more money you will have to pay back.

What happens next
One you have sent us your documents, we will need time to consider them. Please give us 10 working days after you have sent us the documents before you try to contact us.

At the end of our check, we may use the information you gave us in any appeal proceedings to decide your entitlement to tax credits and your liability to repay any tax credits over paid as well as any interest and penalties.

We would welcome your cooperation with our check to establish the correct amount of tax credits due. The extent to which you cooperate with us and provide us with information is entirely a matter for you. In making your decision you may wish to get help from a professional advisor. Our check may show that you have made an error and we may charge you a penalty. I have enclosed the leaflet 'WTC7 Tax credit penalties' which tells you more about this.

If there is anything you wish us to take into account when we consider whether we should charge you a penalty, please let us know as soon as possible.

We may use the information you gave us during our check in any appeal proceedings to decide:
- what tax credits you are entitled to
- what tax credits you should pay back to us if we have paid you too much
- if we should charge you interest and penalties

When we make a decision on your award, you have the right to ask for a mandatory reconsideration if you disagree with our decision and we:
- change your award
- ask you to pay a penalty
- charge you interest on tax credits we have overpaid you

For more information about:
- keeping your tax credits up to date
- when to make a joint or single claim
- penalties and checks
go to www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxcredits

If you have an adviser acting for you. please show them this letter.

About Concentrix and HMRC
Concentrix is working on behalf of HMRC. You can find out more information and confirm that this letter is genuine by visiting the GOV.UK website at this address:
www.hmrc.gov.uk/security/contacts.htm

If you contact us, we can deal with you more quickly if you quote the National Insurance number XXXXXXXXX, Case number XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX and provide a daytime phone number.

Yours sincerely

Concentrix

I received my letter on 5th Feb and called them straight away. I still needed to send them proof, so I did but noted on a cover form that all my accounts are online so they had "greyscale" print outs, and what they said was a "complication" explained! (Not that complicated, me and my ex have a verbal agreement that he pays me a fixed amount every month until I stop receiving child related benefits. This is after numerous mistakes through the CSA system which often left me with no money so we closed that claim but apparently this complicates things.) I sent everything off on the 11th Feb via recorded delivery. The post office tracker showed the letter was signed for on the 17th Feb. I called up on the 25th Feb to find it was on the system but hadn't been looked at. The man on the phone looked at it, and said he'd deal with it that day. On the 26th I then received all my documents and a covering letter, dated 19th Feb (??), by recorded delivery saying thank you and they'll be writing to me shortly about the claim.

Now I'm stuck in limbo waiting to see if my payment goes in as normal tomorrow or not. I have no reason to doubt it as mine is a valid claim, but I know better than to trust everything will go smoothly after past experience!

MissMoneypenny

nicki wrote: »

I'm not prepared to post an image of my letter as I have notes and personal information on it obviously, but I am happy to type it out for you. Bits in bold are in bold on the letter. My letter, dated 27th Jan, says:

Thanks nicki. There is nothing threatening in that letter.

MSE Paloma, what did you see that made you think the letter was threatening?

From the letter Nicki was kind enough to type out and post

"We need to talk to you about whether you are living with a partner"

What's threatening in that?

"You claim tax credits as a single person, but we have evidence that there may be another adult living with you.If you're married, in a civil partnership, or usually live with a partner, you must make a joint claim unless you are legally separated, or your separation is likely to be permanent. "

The word "may" is used. Why is that threatening?

They were even kind enough to embold the section that gave the date the claimant needs to respond by, before their benefits stopped.

Was it that that timeline that you found threatening? From what I read on these boards, all benefit requests have a timeline for a response, or the benefit stops. Tax Credits is a benefit too. If claimants still kept getting their benefits even though they chose not to respond to a letter from a benefits office, what incentive would there be for them to respond to their benefit checks?

As said on this thread, this letter is just a benefit check and is nothing new.