Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

Generali

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

No wonder the SNP are sabotaging the negotiations.


http://www.scottishfinancialnews.com/7549/glasgow-uni-economist-says-scottish-economy-now-showing-signs-of-distress/

The Scottish economy has been tanking under SNP rule...

The last thing they want is to end the Westminster subsidy as that would expose just how incompetent they are.

To be fair to the SNP they are quit admirably good at walking the tightrope. They have grasped the subsidy paid by Londoners with both hands and are refusing to let go while promising a land of milk and honey under independence. Their supporters apparently refuse to believe that Scotland is subsidised by Londoners while being trenchant in views that the subsidy shouldn't be removed.

Sometimes I wish Scotland had voted Yes! just to see how the realisation that the SNP had bent Scotland over a table and done to them what Harvey Procter was meant to have done to boy scouts would have played out. I suspect the In! movement would be gathering strength quite quickly by now. Cutting 25% of the NHS wouldn't be much fun for people with cancer north of the border.

Shakethedisease

mwpt wrote: »

I would have called the Tories a center party. To me, the US parties are more to the right while in the UK the Tories still support high state spending on health, welfare and other services. Just because they are trying to moderate the spending doesn't mean they are right wing.

But SNP seem to oppose nearly every spending cut they make, and would actually increase state spending particularly on social welfare, rather than decrease it. That left me assuming they were more left wing / socialist. I get easily confused though.

It's all in the context I suppose. In Scotland the Tories are viewed and very right wing. Labour looking more and more like them since Blair, eventually crashed the party in Scotland. Which is why they're about turning and trying to outdo with the socialist/Corbyn policies.

Shakethedisease

Rinoa wrote: »

SNP.org, SNP facebook and the SNP twitter account all describe SNP as:

"Centre left and social democratic"

I'm sure they do. But the left is a VERY crowded place in Scotland politically. That's why the Conservatives seem so off message up here. Apart from being unashamedly unionist, which Scottish Labour are reversing a bit on now, and picking up a few votes on that. No one is very keen on voting for their other policies.

May 2015

The election also saw the worst performance by the Conservative Party which received its lowest share of the vote since its creation in 1965, although it retained the one seat that it previously held.[

The SNP are center ground north of the border.

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

To be fair to the SNP they are quit admirably good at walking the tightrope. They have grasped the subsidy paid by Londoners with both hands and are refusing to let go while promising a land of milk and honey under independence. Their supporters apparently refuse to believe that Scotland is subsidised by Londoners while being trenchant in views that the subsidy shouldn't be removed.

Sometimes I wish Scotland had voted Yes! just to see how the realisation that the SNP had bent Scotland over a table and done to them what Harvey Procter was meant to have done to boy scouts would have played out. I suspect the In! movement would be gathering strength quite quickly by now. Cutting 25% of the NHS wouldn't be much fun for people with cancer north of the border.

What's your obsession with cancer, and grannies in Scotland. And anyway, Jeremy Hunt and the Tories seem intent on wrecking the English NHS ( as they always do in power ) and they don't even have to worry about 'London subsidies'.





Then there was this today. (OECD report)



Don't lecture anyone on cancer treatment Gen. Scottish independence or not. The Tories are making one real big mess of the English NHS right now. All the 'London subsidies' in the world don't seem to be making much of a difference on that.

I see there is a huge campaign going on just now to tempt junior docs up to Scotland too. There will be many consider it I dare say. They might feel a little more appreciated.

Generali

I'm shocked STD, shocked.

Clearly a 25% cut in funding for the Scottish NHS while having it run from Edinburgh will mean a huge improvement in patient care in your opinion.

The fundamental problem with the SNP's policies is that there is a disconnect between:

1. Spending more money
2. Cutting a huge amount of funding by quitting the Union.

The reality is that the extent of the cuts required by enacting #2 means that lots of Scots will die of cancer and be poorly educated so that you can get shot of the English. It's a heck of a price to pay.

Rinoa

Shakethedisease wrote: »

The SNP are center ground north of the border.

That's still socialism. Fair enough if that's what you all want, I'm just surprised you think their policies aren't socialist.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Shakethedisease wrote: »

The SNP are center ground north of the border.

One of the frequent complaints about the SNP is that they 'talk left but act right' and that's probably not a million miles away from the truth.

As has frequently been pointed out the SNP has two distinct factions within it, the left wing Socialist faction that has been so successful at taking on Labour in it's former post industrial heartlands through the Central Belt, and the right wing conservative 'Tartan Tories' from the East and North.

Those two factions make strange bedfellows, and without the common cause of Indy, the party would have fractured long ago.

The end result of such a schism is that the party tends to hover around the centre left with most policies.

Not because that's where either of the two factions want to be, but because it's the only place they can end up and not fall out with each other.

Generali

I realise that it's the Express but I suspect that this tells you all you need to know about Labour in Scotland:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/643733/SNP-landslide-got-rid-of-40-useless-Labour-MPs-claims-Corbyn-cabinet-minister

The Scottish Nationalist Party surged to victory north of the border in the 2015 General Election, claiming 56 of the nation’s 59 seats in the previous Labour stronghold.

But in an anecdote shared by political analyst Philip Cowley, one senior Labour MP reportedly claimed the benefit of the crushing blow – which saw a balanced race between the two main parties turn into a majority win for the Conservatives – was unseating “useless” MPs.

I don't claim any expert knowledge here but I do suspect that Labour have treated Scotland as their fief for years and got their comeuppance.

CLAPTON

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

One of the frequent complaints about the SNP is that they 'talk left but act right' and that's probably not a million miles away from the truth.

As has frequently been pointed out the SNP has two distinct factions within it, the left wing Socialist faction that has been so successful at taking on Labour in it's former post industrial heartlands through the Central Belt, and the right wing conservative 'Tartan Tories' from the East and North.

Those two factions make strange bedfellows, and without the common cause of Indy, the party would have fractured long ago.

The end result of such a schism is that the party tends to hover around the centre left with most policies.

Not because that's where either of the two factions want to be, but because it's the only place they can end up and not fall out with each other.

quite paradoxical really, as the Tories talk right wing but are introducing left wing policies : maybe post independence there will be a center (tory in all but name) government

zagubov

Generali wrote: »

I realise that it's the Express but I suspect that this tells you all you need to know about Labour in Scotland:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/643733/SNP-landslide-got-rid-of-40-useless-Labour-MPs-claims-Corbyn-cabinet-minister



I don't claim any expert knowledge here but I do suspect that Labour have treated Scotland as their fief for years and got their comeuppance.

Precisely so :T

It's hard for people from outside Scotland to find out how much being in Scotland was like a one-party-state. Everybody who lived there knew it; but the media weren't going to talk about it.

Scottish Labour had too much influence and also too much inertia. The gravitational wave from their collapse launched the SNP into orbit, it didn't get there under its own power.