sorry, more probate help

treecol

It's now clear that probate will not need to be obtained for my late mother in law with regards to her property as it was owned with her husband as joint tenants.
But she owned a piece of land which will pass to him. The family are saying their solicitor says no probate needed re house, but I know he won't be aware of the land. I'm unsure of the value, but it's over £5k. So surely because of that alone probate is needed? Otherwise he won't be able to register it in his name, will he? She hasn't detailed it on her will as such, but it's tricky as we have never seen a will...I don't know if, as hubby as joint executor, the solicitor who wrote the will for MIL would send us a copy.

mgdavid

treecol wrote: »

..... She hasn't detailed it on her will as such, but it's tricky as we have never seen a will........

Makes no sense as read - if never seen it, how do you know it's not detailed?

treecol

because my mother in law told us what the will said. We've just never seen the hard copy.

G6JNS

treecol wrote: »

It's now clear that probate will not need to be obtained for my late mother in law with regards to her property as it was owned with her husband as joint tenants.
But she owned a piece of land which will pass to him. The family are saying their solicitor says no probate needed re house, but I know he won't be aware of the land. I'm unsure of the value, but it's over £5k. So surely because of that alone probate is needed? Otherwise he won't be able to register it in his name, will he? She hasn't detailed it on her will as such, but it's tricky as we have never seen a will...I don't know if, as hubby as joint executor, the solicitor who wrote the will for MIL would send us a copy.

If your husband is a joint executor why cant he just tell the solicitor? Or have I missed something?

BobQ

treecol wrote: »

It's now clear that probate will not need to be obtained for my late mother in law with regards to her property as it was owned with her husband as joint tenants.
But she owned a piece of land which will pass to him. The family are saying their solicitor says no probate needed re house, but I know he won't be aware of the land. I'm unsure of the value, but it's over £5k. So surely because of that alone probate is needed? Otherwise he won't be able to register it in his name, will he? She hasn't detailed it on her will as such, but it's tricky as we have never seen a will...I don't know if, as hubby as joint executor, the solicitor who wrote the will for MIL would send us a copy.

Get Hubby to the solicitor and explain that MIL told you that Hubby was the joint executor of the Will. Ask if he holds the original Will.

If solicitor does and Hubby is an executor, at the very least the Solicitor will provide a copy in return of proof of death. If hubby is the sole executor he is entitled to the original will, If the solicitor is am executor or someone else is, he will tell you.

Whether or not you need to apply for Probate is another matter. If Hubby is the executor, he may want legal advice, but does not need to use the same solicitor.

Does he have a reason not to trust the solicitor?

treecol

I've done a bit more digging. I called land registry & it seems they were tenants in common, so the land registry say yes, probate needed for house but more importantly for the land she owned.
I tried to call the solicitor to get a copy of the will, he is away till Monday. I've always had a good experience dealing with him in the past. We just wanted all the facts as I'm sure you know from this section of the forum, when relatives are involved, things need careful handling. HMRC say they advise probate is always applied for when there is property involved, regardless of circumstances.
Hubby is happy to carry out his duty as executor, but I suspect the other executor doesn't want to do it. Not sure what happens then.
With regard to the will, I will eventually obtain an original.
Thank you for helping.

RAS

There was a thread on here about a "family" property that had been passed from parents to husband to wife to son from one marriage or some such, with no probate done for any of them.

Apart from the small fact that the property was not registered, it looked like the new generation were going to have to get several lots of letters of administration with will and letters for the most recent death. With little or no paper work to guide them.

BobQ

treecol wrote: »

I've done a bit more digging. I called land registry & it seems they were tenants in common, so the land registry say yes, probate needed for house but more importantly for the land she owned.
I tried to call the solicitor to get a copy of the will, he is away till Monday. I've always had a good experience dealing with him in the past. We just wanted all the facts as I'm sure you know from this section of the forum, when relatives are involved, things need careful handling. HMRC say they advise probate is always applied for when there is property involved, regardless of circumstances.
Hubby is happy to carry out his duty as executor, but I suspect the other executor doesn't want to do it. Not sure what happens then.
With regard to the will, I will eventually obtain an original.
Thank you for helping.

It does not have to be complicated with relatives involved. Hubby can act as executor if he is the only one of those named willing to do it unless the will states otherwise. The other could always renounce the job.

http://www.lawpack.co.uk/probate/articles/article7428.asp

Probate is just a formalisation of the role of the executor giving legal authority to the role, whether probate is needed largely depends on what those you have to deal with require it. But in this case they clearly will need it.

You do need legal advice.
.

treecol

BobQ wrote: »

You do need legal advice.
.

Quite, but when the family solicitor says probate isn't needed, it is worrying as to who will give the correct advice. I'll go with what HMRC & Land Registry say. If I can find relevant info on the net about the need for probate for property & land, I'll print it & give that to the other executor.

BobQ

treecol wrote: »

Quite, but when the family solicitor says probate isn't needed, it is worrying as to who will give the correct advice. I'll go with what HMRC & Land Registry say. If I can find relevant info on the net about the need for probate for property & land, I'll print it & give that to the other executor.

If the family solicitor is in full possession of the facts then he could be correct. HMRC are there to advise on the Probate process not what you should do in your individual situation.

As I have said a Grant is a legal authority to execute the Will and so a Grant of Probate is needed if any person you deal with as an executor requires it.

If the deceased has £2000 in a bank, most banks will release it based on the will, but for £20000 they will require Probate. It is their choice.

If a property is unregistered you can transfer its ownership by signing a Deed prepared by a solicitor. So if you are just transferring to a family member you can avoid Probate. I am not sure if you now have to register the property. That is one for the land registry but 5 years ago I transferred property that was unregistered in this way.

If you are selling it will need to be registered by the buyer (strictly) but in practice the seller and they will expect legal proof that you are authorised to sell which probably means Probate. Registration and Probate are unconnected.

getmore4less

BobQ wrote: »

If the deceased has £2000 in a bank, most banks will release it based on the will, but for £20000 they will require Probate. It is their choice.

Most banks will go over £20k without a grant.