The Care Act 2014

cattermole

SandraScarlett wrote: »

I'm amazed how many postcode lotteries exist in the Care System. If I'm reading Nanny correctly, the most anybody pays for care in her area, which I'm assuming is non-residential, is about £35 a week. My DH was paying over 4 times that!!


A friend in Leeds can get incontinence pads or pants provided for her DH. In London, you can only get pads. I had to fight tooth and nail, and threaten to appeal to the Court of Human Rights to get pants supplied for my DH, and yet they wee the same, wherever they live.


Alzheimer's Disease is still classed as a social situation, rather than an illness, with regards to who pays what regarding residential care costs. I know the Money Cake can't be sliced any thinner, and if this Act can do away with the anomalies, that'll be great, but there's always going to be areas open to interpretation.


xx

How are you SS? xx

Yes you are right about the lottery, Fairer Charging was supposed to go someway to alleviating the lottery that is Charging. Ironically in our Authority your DH would only be paying 1/2 his DLA/AA. Any other income would not be counted at all.
So the unfairness has swung too much the other way, meaning those with no other income than benefits are taken below the minimum guarantee.

Pads/Pants are supplied by Health, many will not do the pants which is very wrong as they have to meet the needs of the "patient" so you were right to kick up a fuss. However any incontinence supplies that are not supplied by Health can be offset as a DRE on a care package. You then have the problem with your Authority that they were capping at £40 a week, which sounds a lot but in your case you had a lot of private stuff to pay out for to meet his care needs on top of your LA charges. x

Very few packages particularly for over 65's have "social" needs in them, being unable to wash, dress or toilet yourself has become a "social" need but it is a basic need arising out of a Health condition of some kind.

However at long last you can now have a DP from Health, this has been a very long time coming and one of the main differences is that you cannot be charged for Health care (because it is free at the point of delivery).

I don't think the new Care Act will change non residential care charges very much. Apart from they will be less likely to do something which is already unlawful because its going to be tied up in regulations.

Sadly I think the over 65's will continue to be the main losers in getting the care they need. As always those in the low/middle incomes will be the ones who suffer the most in term of charging. I would be more in favor of a % charging system on disposable income because this would be much fairer I think.

cattermole

nannytone wrote: »

youre reading it right.
unless you have savings above 16k the MOST anyone is asked to contribute it £142 a month regardless of services provided.
if i received 1 hours help a week it would cost the same as my 25 hours cost.
it only went up this month from £106

Are you sure about that Nanny re the number of hours? I will check but I don't think they can charge more than the service actually costs to deliver.

cattermole

onlygoingforward wrote: »

Sorry yes ( think the penny has dropped) that would make it less than IS plus 25%.
As your maximum charge prior to any DRE for someone on basic PCGC and AA for example would be £148.35 + £61.10 + £54.45 - £185.44 = £78.46 max charge before DRES (and housing costs).

But yours would be a charge of £61.10 + £27.22 = £88.32 per week which leaves your buffer at only £175.58 therefore £9.86 short of the IS plus 25%. So you are quite right.

Regard should be paid to the effect of any charge on a user’s net income;
net incomes should not be reduced below defined basic levels of Income Support or the Guarantee Credit of Pension Credit, plus 25%. Charging policies which reduce users’ net incomes below these defined basic levels are not acceptable and undermine policies for social inclusion
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/208323/Fairer_Charging_Guidance_final_2013-06-20_rc.pdf


Just not used to another council charging higher than us, as most who come here tells us how little they paid for care before moving to our area.

No worries we got there in the end and your insight is very helpful.

You know the specific figures as you work in the field. So can you just clarify them a bit more that I've got it right below please?

148.35 is the pension including pension credit
61.10 is the SDP
54.45 is lower rate AA

= 263.90 minus - 185.44 (minimum income guarantee for age + 25%) leaves a maximum chargeable amount of £78.46

So even without any DRE at all they are below the Minimum specified in law by £9.86?

Can you work out the figures for someone over and under 25 for me please? Assuming they are in the Support Group for ESA and do it for someone living alone and/or with a carer. Do it on middle rate DLA.

Many thanks.

nannytone_2

cattermole wrote: »

Are you sure about that Nanny re the number of hours? I will check but I don't think they can charge more than the service actually costs to deliver.

i think i was over exaggerating a little in order to prove a point
i would pay the ame amount for 3 hours as i do for 25

SandraScarlett

cattermole wrote: »

How are you SS? xx

Yes you are right about the lottery, Fairer Charging was supposed to go someway to alleviating the lottery that is Charging. Ironically in our Authority your DH would only be paying 1/2 his DLA/AA. Any other income would not be counted at all.
So the unfairness has swung too much the other way, meaning those with no other income than benefits are taken below the minimum guarantee.

Pads/Pants are supplied by Health, many will not do the pants which is very wrong as they have to meet the needs of the "patient" so you were right to kick up a fuss. However any incontinence supplies that are not supplied by Health can be offset as a DRE on a care package. You then have the problem with your Authority that they were capping at £40 a week, which sounds a lot but in your case you had a lot of private stuff to pay out for to meet his care needs on top of your LA charges. x

Very few packages particularly for over 65's have "social" needs in them, being unable to wash, dress or toilet yourself has become a "social" need but it is a basic need arising out of a Health condition of some kind.

However at long last you can now have a DP from Health, this has been a very long time coming and one of the main differences is that you cannot be charged for Health care (because it is free at the point of delivery).

I don't think the new Care Act will change non residential care charges very much. Apart from they will be less likely to do something which is already unlawful because its going to be tied up in regulations.

Sadly I think the over 65's will continue to be the main losers in getting the care they need. As always those in the low/middle incomes will be the ones who suffer the most in term of charging. I would be more in favor of a % charging system on disposable income because this would be much fairer I think.

Thank you so much for your kind enquiry. Your help was invaluable to me when DH was at home, and I had Direct Payments. Unfortunately, he is very poorly at the moment. He had a UTI, which knocked him for 6, and he ended up collapsing and being hospitalised. As he only has one kidney, the other one having atrophied about 10 years ago, this didn't help.


I stayed at his bedside constantly in A & E, as I was frightened to leave his side, as even though I'd given them chapter and verse on his condition, including Alzheimer's, this was ignored. For example, when I asked if he'd ate his breakfast I was told "he didn't want it".


I asked if this meant that he turned his face away when they tried to feed him, and on seeing the various rapid looks passing between the staff, I correctly guessed that they'd ignored the info I gave of "no hand to mouth co-ordination at all", and just removed the untouched food!


He then went onto a ward, but became very violent towards the staff, so a sedative was prescribed. Unfortunately, this sent his blood pressure rapidly down, and he went into a coma. He's now out of that, and back in the Care Home, but doesn't even know who I am, which is obviously very distressing.


But I know he's safe, warm and well cared for, and only 5 minutes from home by car, and I can visit him daily, often 2 or even 3 times a day. You do a superb job, Cattermole, helping so many people, and I hope you have a lovely Christmas and a Happy New Year. I'm joining DH at the Home, and they're going to do a table for the 2 of us, like a date.


As he doesn't know who I am, it'll be a blind date!


xx

nannytone_2

what an awful time youve had, i cant say anything that will make a difference apart from sending my sympathy.
if its any consolation, this whole episode os probably far more distressing for you than it was for your husband.
sending you and your husband my very best wishes

SandraScarlett

Thank you so much for your good wishes Nanny, and you're quite right. My DH lives in his own world and is oblivious to the upsetting sides of his many illnesses.


But you're wrong when you say you can't say anything that'll be of help, because just knowing someone is thinking of you, is a great comfort. I'm now the person that others cross the road to avoid!


Although it's distressing to see someone you've loved for 50 years deteriorate the way he has, at least DH and I had many decades together of happiness, for which I'm thankful. I can manage the cost of his care, without leaving myself penniless, and I've been able to have "things" repaired, replaced or done, without too many problems.


I can fight his corner but my real fear is for the thousands, probably tens of thousands, who have nobody to do this for them, or somebody who, probably because of their own advanced years, just can't.


xx

margaretclare

I am so, so sorry for you, Sandra. It must be terribly distressing to see your husband in that state, remembering him as he used to be.

nannytone_2

SandraScarlett wrote: »

Thank you so much for your good wishes Nanny, and you're quite right. My DH lives in his own world and is oblivious to the upsetting sides of his many illnesses.


But you're wrong when you say you can't say anything that'll be of help, because just knowing someone is thinking of you, is a great comfort. I'm now the person that others cross the road to avoid!


Although it's distressing to see someone you've loved for 50 years deteriorate the way he has, at least DH and I had many decades together of happiness, for which I'm thankful. I can manage the cost of his care, without leaving myself penniless, and I've been able to have "things" repaired, replaced or done, without too many problems.


I can fight his corner but my real fear is for the thousands, probably tens of thousands, who have nobody to do this for them, or somebody who, probably because of their own advanced years, just can't.


xx

i admit, that if we met in person, i wouldnt know what to say ...
but i would tell you as much...
i also wouldnt cross the road!
i know words on a screen dpnt help too much , but your positive outlook, and strength in hard times really humbles me.
and i dont say that lightly

cattermole

Awww Sandra I want to give you a big hug. xxx What a terrible time you have been through recently with all this stress and worry with him in hospital. xxx

Your lovely warm and positive way of looking at things always comes through on here. So those who cross the road, it makes me angry tbh. I know people don't know what to say sometimes but just a smile and how are you is all that's needed.

I found it heart breaking watching my Dad deteriorate with Dementia I cannot imagine what it would be like to see my husband like that. It's such a cruel disease.

You are so right about those that don't have someone to stand their corner for them, it is all so sad.

Thanks for your nice words to me, I'd like to do more to help to be honest I've been less active since Lucy and my Dad passed away on Disability issues and the over 65's are the group that I feel get the worst deal when it comes to care.

Anytime you want to chat just PM me. Lots of xxx