difficult solicitor/executor

topbanana1985

My mum suddenly and unexpectedly passed away in january, I am her eldest and I have 2 sisters and 2 brothers (Im still in my 20s and youngest brother is only 13 years old, and no dad, he died years ago, so just us kids now. Dont worry, little bro does have a legal guardian)

We are all close and all 5 of us are the beneficiaries in mums will.

The trouble we are having is with the executor of the will. A solicitor is named as executor of mums will, after discussions as a family, we decided we would like to have done the probate ourselves with me as main executor. We asked if the named solicitor/executor would either renounce or take power reserved.
They quite rudely refused and insisted that they do it.
So reluctantly and without choice we handed it all over to them (after me and my sisters doing A LOT of the work already, by way of contacting companies and informing of the death, as well as gathering together all the debts and assets, organising it all and getting it all in order, thus we had pretty much done half their job for them, to the point of all they had to do was fill in the IHT and probate forms)

Since handing it over to them it has been nothing but delays, excuses, lack of info and updates and when we are given info theres contradictions.

Ive not had any updates from them since august, despite me asking them several times, only to be ignored .5 emails and 3 phone calls, emails completely ignored and phone calls met with 'sorry they are not in the office, they will phone you back' but never do.

Updates prior to august have been the likes of 'we still have some things to do, its going to be another few weeks yet', so a bit vague to say the least.

At one point I asked (well tried to ask) 'who gets the interest earned on the money whilst its awaiting to be distributed to us?' Only to be rudely interrupted before I could finish this question and was told, 'we dont have the money sitting about, we pay all the debts of the estate, then give out interim payments to the beneficiaries only keeping aside a small amount just in case any unknown debts come in'
I was told this just after probate was granted and all the assets had come into the estate, thus I knew full well that all the money was in their possession at that time, which was in june. 5 months on, we have still had nothing.
So I am still curious as to who gets the interest that the money is currently earning whilst sitting in the estate bank account. Anyone know?

I am also frustrated and annoyed that they say one thing but it completely contradicts with their actions.

We are also very worried at what their bill is going to be. During our meeting in january when we were pretty much forced into using them as executors, we were told verbally that it will cost £2,500 - £3,500 and they will gain probate in about 2-3 months.
It actually took 5 months to gain probate and we have not heard any more on the costs.

Hence our worry that they are going to hit us with a hefty bill at the end, without any prior warning. Are they allowed to do this? Can they charge without first informing us of the charges or any increases above their original estimate?

We are very near to starting a complaint and we have asked for their complaints procedure, which has also been ignored.

any advice or info would be greatly appreciated.

rpc

topbanana1985 wrote: »

We are very near to starting a complaint and we have asked for their complaints procedure, which has also been ignored.

Speak to the SRA or Legal Ombudsman?

http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/for-the-public/faqs/complaining-about-a-solicitor/

Crabapple

Interest wise - if it is over a certain amount they must pay it out to the beneficiaries. I think it's about £20, so please don't be concerned that they are earning huge amounts of interest at your expense.

The rest of it, it's all extremely poor. You first need to find out who the complaints partner is in the firm. There must be someone nominated to deal with complaints. You should contact them, advise the issues you are having with not being updated, no replies to contact and that the staff have been rude.

You also need to complain that you have not been given costs estimates in writing and if necessary updated. You should have been given this information in the early stages (which incidentally should also have come with a copy of their terms of business and somewhere in all of that they should set out how complaints are to be dealt with.

Check their website for details of the complaints or senior partner if you get nowhere with the staff you are dealing with. If by chance the person in charge of your case is the boss then go to the SRA as stated above.

g6jns_2

topbanana1985 wrote: »

My mum suddenly and unexpectedly passed away in january, I am her eldest and I have 2 sisters and 2 brothers (Im still in my 20s and youngest brother is only 13 years old, and no dad, he died years ago, so just us kids now. Dont worry, little bro does have a legal guardian)

We are all close and all 5 of us are the beneficiaries in mums will.

The trouble we are having is with the executor of the will. A solicitor is named as executor of mums will, after discussions as a family, we decided we would like to have done the probate ourselves with me as main executor. We asked if the named solicitor/executor would either renounce or take power reserved.
They quite rudely refused and insisted that they do it.
So reluctantly and without choice we handed it all over to them (after me and my sisters doing A LOT of the work already, by way of contacting companies and informing of the death, as well as gathering together all the debts and assets, organising it all and getting it all in order, thus we had pretty much done half their job for them, to the point of all they had to do was fill in the IHT and probate forms)

Since handing it over to them it has been nothing but delays, excuses, lack of info and updates and when we are given info theres contradictions.

Ive not had any updates from them since august, despite me asking them several times, only to be ignored .5 emails and 3 phone calls, emails completely ignored and phone calls met with 'sorry they are not in the office, they will phone you back' but never do.

Updates prior to august have been the likes of 'we still have some things to do, its going to be another few weeks yet', so a bit vague to say the least.

At one point I asked (well tried to ask) 'who gets the interest earned on the money whilst its awaiting to be distributed to us?' Only to be rudely interrupted before I could finish this question and was told, 'we dont have the money sitting about, we pay all the debts of the estate, then give out interim payments to the beneficiaries only keeping aside a small amount just in case any unknown debts come in'
I was told this just after probate was granted and all the assets had come into the estate, thus I knew full well that all the money was in their possession at that time, which was in june. 5 months on, we have still had nothing.
So I am still curious as to who gets the interest that the money is currently earning whilst sitting in the estate bank account. Anyone know?

I am also frustrated and annoyed that they say one thing but it completely contradicts with their actions.

We are also very worried at what their bill is going to be. During our meeting in january when we were pretty much forced into using them as executors, we were told verbally that it will cost £2,500 - £3,500 and they will gain probate in about 2-3 months.
It actually took 5 months to gain probate and we have not heard any more on the costs.

Hence our worry that they are going to hit us with a hefty bill at the end, without any prior warning. Are they allowed to do this? Can they charge without first informing us of the charges or any increases above their original estimate?

We are very near to starting a complaint and we have asked for their complaints procedure, which has also been ignored.

any advice or info would be greatly appreciated.

This must be really hard for you. Phone and ask for an appointment with the senior partner who deals with complaints. You have to do that before you can involve any outside authority.

ameliarate

I am very sorry for your loss and that you are going through difficulties. I have gone through similar with the solicitor ignoring my emails, taking much longer than things should and excuses all the time. Never again will I use a Solicitor.

I would send a very strongly worded email/letter stating that if you do not get answers to your questions you will be making a formal complaint. Number/list your questions, including their reasons for the delays.

Good luck.

RAS

topbanana1985 wrote: »

Ive not had any updates from them since august, despite me asking them several times, only to be ignored .5 emails and 3 phone calls, emails completely ignored and phone calls met with 'sorry they are not in the office, they will phone you back' but never do.

Hi

Their behaviour is not really acceptable but there are a few things you need to get your head round.

1. You are not the client (nor are any of your siblings). The client is the estate of mum.

2. As a beneficiary, you are legally entitled to no information until the estate is distributed.

3. Every one of those e-mails and phone calls is likely to attract a charge when you contact them and when ever they reply. How much do they charge per letter, e-mail and phone call and per 10 minutes staff time? If you want them to keep the cost down, you have to keep the number of enquiries down.

4. Once probate is granted, solicitors routinely advertsie for creditors and wait 6 months before disbursement.

Crabapple

I've been huntinng for information about this situation. I thought that it was a requirement that residuary beneficiaries are given costs information.

Apparently it is only a matter of 'good practice'. This seems manifestly unfair as there are rights for a residuary beneficiary to apply for costs breakdowns etc after the event.

There is no excuse though for never replying to a beneficiary. If all the beneficiaries are calling daily then the costs will definitely escalate, but it is not unreasonable for a beneficiary to ask for information occasionally, especially as they have no lay executor to go to.

I still think an internal complaint is deserved. If they are waiting for statutory notices/periods to expire then it's very simple to tell the beneficiaries that they won't be able to distribute until x date. Everyone is then happy, they are no longer being chased and the beneficiaries don't need to.

topbanana1985

RAS wrote: »

Hi

Their behaviour is not really acceptable but there are a few things you need to get your head round.

1. You are not the client (nor are any of your siblings). The client is the estate of mum.

2. As a beneficiary, you are legally entitled to no information until the estate is distributed.

3. Every one of those e-mails and phone calls is likely to attract a charge when you contact them and when ever they reply. How much do they charge per letter, e-mail and phone call and per 10 minutes staff time? If you want them to keep the cost down, you have to keep the number of enquiries down.

4. Once probate is granted, solicitors routinely advertsie for creditors and wait 6 months before disbursement.

Thank you all for the info and condolences.
If we had our way, we would not have used them at all, but sadly having being forced to use them and now are stuck makes it all the worse.

1. Yes, I know we are not the clients, if we were the clients we would have fired them/parted ways months ago. In fact we woulndt have even approached them in the first place, given the choice.

2. I would have thought we would have been entitled to some info, or at least progress of it, if we asked them. Is this true, if we ask them for an update on progress, then can they really refuse to provide it?

3. again, I know I am likely being charged for each time I contact, but surely they should have replied to the first contact. Had they done so, there would be no need for the other contacts. This being the case, looks to me like they are deliberately ignoring us just so they can charge us more money. Can they do this?

4. we were told that the advert for creditors and debts was placed and that it would only be 2 months (the 2 months that they stated came to an end on the 1st Oct and not to mention again that they told us they give out interim payments)

In the mean time I am struggling to pay all the bills on the family home so my siblings can continue to live there, this is on top of my own bills and home as Im the only one who has moved out.

Crabapple- thank you for the info on interest. Im aware any interest earned may be minimal, but as Tescos say 'every little helps' ;-)

We shall be putting in a complaint. I have looked on the ombudsman website and seen that they should have given us a client letter after our first meeting in january (no surprise that we werent given one)

topbanana1985

Crabapple wrote: »

I've been huntinng for information about this situation. I thought that it was a requirement that residuary beneficiaries are given costs information.

Apparently it is only a matter of 'good practice'. This seems manifestly unfair as there are rights for a residuary beneficiary to apply for costs breakdowns etc after the event.

There is no excuse though for never replying to a beneficiary. If all the beneficiaries are calling daily then the costs will definitely escalate, but it is not unreasonable for a beneficiary to ask for information occasionally, especially as they have no lay executor to go to.

I still think an internal complaint is deserved. If they are waiting for statutory notices/periods to expire then it's very simple to tell the beneficiaries that they won't be able to distribute until x date. Everyone is then happy, they are no longer being chased and the beneficiaries don't need to.

I have discovered that on their own website it states 'no hidden costs, you will always be kept informed of legal charges, you will be given an estimate of fees in advance, Once we begin the work, we will keep you informed' (I vaguely remember seeing a poster of similar statements in their office)

This being on their own website, I see this a further grounds for complaint, surely?

And yes, if they kept us informed, or at least given us a date, we would have no need to keep asking as we would have had the info we needed. At the moment we are completely in the dark and the 'when will this be finished' is as long as a piece of string. :-/

TonyMMM

topbanana1985 wrote: »

they should have given us a client letter after our first meeting in january (no surprise that we werent given one)

You are not their client - they should have explained their charges to your mother at the time she chose to appoint them as her executor. It would be usual for them to charge an hourly rate, plus (in many cases) a % of the estate value.

They have no contractual relationship with you whatsoever, you are not employing them. They do not have to talk to you at all.

However, common courtesy suggests that they should respond to your enquiries, but the time taken to respond to you would be chargeable as part of their costs of winding up the estate.

getmore4less

This is a STEP guide to troublesome executors.

http://www.step.org/tackling-troublesome-executors