Getting letters from bailiff for previous owners

davidmcn

kinger101 wrote: »

Well, the letter is to the addressee (person), not the address (location), so this doesn't follow. I.e., if it has someone's name on that isn't yours, you'd better have a good reason for opening it. Copied from CAB:

Is it against the law to open someone else’s mail?

Opening someone else’s mail is allowed in certain circumstances under the Postal Services Act 2000. It is only an offence if you open someone else’s mail ‘without reasonable excuse’ or if you ‘intend to act to another’s detriment'. For example, if you are receiving bank statements/cards in someone else’s name then you should act on that immediately. You should tell the sender, either by returning it marked “not known at this address” or by opening the mail and calling any number provided within. The “reasonable excuse” for opening such items would then be that you were helping to prevent fraud against the companies involved.

The CAB advice is wrong. You'd be better to read the Act itself. The legislation is mainly concerned with ensuring that the postal service does its bit without the mail being interfered with. The definition of "correctly delivered" is by reference to the address, not the name on it. If it's been put through the correct letterbox then you can open it.

theartfullodger

It is surprising how many envelopes from debt collectors just "fall open"....

kinger101

davidmcn wrote: »

The CAB advice is wrong. You'd be better to read the Act itself. The legislation is mainly concerned with ensuring that the postal service does its bit without the mail being interfered with. The definition of "correctly delivered" is by reference to the address, not the name on it. If it's been put through the correct letterbox then you can open it.

Er.....

s84(3) A person commits an offence if, intending to act to a person’s detriment and without reasonable excuse, he opens a postal packet which he knows or reasonably suspects has been incorrectly delivered to him.

him, of course, would imply a person, not an address.

TBagpuss

The bar is pretty high. To be illegal to open it you would have to be deliberately planning to act to the detriment of the other person, AND to be without reasonable excuse.

In practical terms, the offence is there to help deal with situations where someone is stealing post, or involved in identity theft.

iopening post delivered to your home in order to decide whether to bin it or to return it sender is fine, as is opening to with a view to advising the sender that they have the wrong address.

In terms of your situation, OP - I presume that you gave the energy company readings and made clear your were opening a new account and were liable for energy used from the date you moved in only?

If you do get bailiffs round, make a note of their names and the company they are from, explain the situation and give them the forwarding address if you have one, or the Estate Agents details if not, and let them know that if they return you will contact the police.

They may ask for evidence that you are the new owner - they are not entitled to this - you d not have to tell them anything.

When I was a student, we got bailiffs around looking for our landlords quite a lot. They were always perfectly polite and didn't hassle us, but it was a bit of a nuisance. In the end we printed off some flyer type notices which said something along the lines of :

"[Name of Landlords] do not live at this address. We do not know their current address. The property is rented to us and the agents are [name, address and tel. numbers] We suggest that you direct any enquiries to the agents. Please do not contact us further as we cannot give any additional information"

We handed one to any bailiff or debt collector who turned up. In your case, give the estate agents details rather than the letting agent.

Bart1

I would just ignore everything. I certainly would not be giving balifs/debt collectors/scumbags various a forwading address even if I had it..... Why should I take sides in someone else's civil dispute?

thesaint

Do not ignore the letters. That is foolhardy advice.
Either open the letters and contact the debt collectors etc, or write "Gone Away" with a date if necessary.

Do not write "Not known" and then post them back. They are two different things, and should illicit different responses.

davidmcn

kinger101 wrote: »

Er.....

s84(3) A person commits an offence if, intending to act to a person’s detriment and without reasonable excuse, he opens a postal packet which he knows or reasonably suspects has been incorrectly delivered to him.

him, of course, would imply a person, not an address.

Not once you've read the definitions clause to check what "delivered" means.

S. 125:

(c)the delivery of a postal packet—

(i)at the premises to which it is addressed...

shall be a delivery to the addressee.

So the postie has correctly delivered anything addressed to Fred Bloggs at 21 Acacia Avenue if it's put through your letterbox at number 21. The fact that Fred Bloggs no longer lives there, or has never lived there, is irrelevant.

If you receive something for 23 Acacia Avenue, that's been incorrectly delivered, and only then do you need to worry about your reasonable excuses for opening it rather than taking it next door.

kinger101

davidmcn wrote: »

Not once you've read the definitions clause to check what "delivered" means.

S. 125:
So the postie has correctly delivered anything addressed to Fred Bloggs at 21 Acacia Avenue if it's put through your letterbox at number 21. The fact that Fred Bloggs no longer lives there, or has never lived there, is irrelevant.

If you receive something for 23 Acacia Avenue, that's been incorrectly delivered, and only then do you need to worry about your reasonable excuses for opening it rather than taking it next door.

The problem with your interpretation is that if I lived in an HMO, it would give everyone the right to open my mail. I don't think this was the intention of the act, so I wouldn't like to use this interpretation in court if someone argued I'd acted in their detriment.

Dan-Dan

kinger101 wrote: »

Well, the letter is to the addressee (person), not the address (location), so this doesn't follow. I.e., if it has someone's name on that isn't yours, you'd better have a good reason for opening it. Copied from CAB:

Is it against the law to open someone else’s mail?

Opening someone else’s mail is allowed in certain circumstances under the Postal Services Act 2000. It is only an offence if you open someone else’s mail ‘without reasonable excuse’ or if you ‘intend to act to another’s detriment'. For example, if you are receiving bank statements/cards in someone else’s name then you should act on that immediately. You should tell the sender, either by returning it marked “not known at this address” or by opening the mail and calling any number provided within. The “reasonable excuse” for opening such items would then be that you were helping to prevent fraud against the companies involved.

And the OP does have a good reason , so whats your point ?

davidmcn

kinger101 wrote: »

The problem with your interpretation is that if I lived in an HMO, it would give everyone the right to open my mail.

And if it's the address you live at, in what way has your mail been "incorrectly delivered"? The Act is about making sure the post gets to the correct letterboxes without being interfered with. If someone you live with is opening your mail then you'll need to sort that out yourself.

If they're doing more than merely opening it, the usual laws of e.g. theft and fraud still apply.