Foreigner car rental PCN

colorsound

Hello all,

I've read the newbies sticky on appealing a PCN but my situation a bit unique. I am from the US and hired a car for a week. I received a PCN in a yellow windshield holder last night. The issuer was SIP. I'm not sure what I should do. Can I still appeal? Should I ignore or pay? How can I fight this?

The_Slithy_Tove

If you ignore, SIP will get the car rental company details from the DVLA, and then the rental company are likely to pay the charge and recharge it to you plus an outrageous admin fee. So don't go down that route.

You will need to send in an appeal. In theory you give them your name and your US address, at which point SIP should just give up. However, as they want their pound of flesh, there are a couple of things they may do, both dodgy in the extreme.
(a) They may reply to you saying that a US address is not valid for the purposes of POFA and they'll hold the keeper liable (this is untrue).
(b) They may just go to the DVLA for the keeper details anyway.
Either way, you need to write to the rental company telling them that you have provided SIP your contact details and therefore there is no keeper liability and that they are UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES to pay if SIP contact them. Include a copy of your appeal. (If SIP did get the keeper details under those circumstances they would actually be doing so unlawfully.)

An alternative approach suggested on another similar thread on Pepipoo (http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=94551) is you appeal in your name, but use a UK address, if you can get someone to allow you to use their address. An address in Scotland would be even better. Once they reject your appeal, you tell them you have now moved to the US and that any further correspondence should be directed there. At which point you ignore them. This approach has the advantage that they are unlikely to go to the rental company, with all the hassle that would entail.

Half_way

You could tell em to F off.

On a more serious note you should contact Sip with your home address in order to challenge this.
However before you do that the terms and conditions of your rental agreement will be of use. Most of them talk about fines, penalties, and/or statutory charges this is nothing of the sort and therefore doesnt fall under the scope of most hire/rental companys agreements.

The problem is that many employees of rental companies dont understand this and will try and charge you usualy via a credit card bill when get back home.
in order to prevent this you will need, if possible to post the terms and conditions of the vehicle hire/rental agreement.
Then you will need to get in touch with the ire company and tell them what has happened you will also need to tell them that by providing SIP with a serviceable address ( in the USA) they have no responsibility to pay SIP under the protection of freedoms act ( or something like that ) and that any deductions from your card for this matter will be unathorised.
Sip should then write to you in the USA demanding this that and anyuthing else- basicaly you can tell them to get stuffed. however you could submit a POPla challenge from afar win and then have the satisfaction that youve just cost SIP £27+tax.
Stay here, - more people will follow with more advice, but your T+C's are important.

HO87

If the OP replies to SIP directly and provides them with an address at which he "...for the time being resides or can be conveniently contacted" then SIP will have no reason to make an enquiry of DVLA and the hire company will not need to be involved. That removes the risk of a charge/chargeback battle with a card company and the hirers. There is no requirement in POFA that the driver's address must be serviceable i.e. an address at which documents may be served - that only applies to the registered keeper - Sch 4, para 2(1)(b).

Although a US address is well out of the jurisdiction I am not sure SIP will accept it and on that basis the OP may wish to avail himself of the accommodation address services available via such organisations as parkingticketappeals (a fee is payable - and I am not in anyway connected with the business).

Coupon-mad

Yep send an appeal as driver - can you email appeals to them according to the PCN? If so use a throw-away new gmail or Hotmail account specially for this scam (or online appeal if they do that). Make sure your home USA postal address is on the appeal and that you do, clearly, ID yourself as the driver.

I wouldn't copy the long appeal in the Newbies thread. Certainly do not alert them to the fact it's a hire car so choose your words carefully! I would go for a simpler:



Re PCN: xxxxxxx (name and postal address and date)

Dear Sip Parking Ltd (Trading as: ANPReye, Morgan Knightley & Co, SIP Car Parks, Simple Intelligent Parking, Stops Illegal Parking)

I am writing to challenge the 'PCN' you put on my car in one of the above guises - interesting Trading name - not very snappy though.

I was driving the car at the relevant time. I understand that you are seeking to hold me responsible for some sort of fake parking fine arising out of the event.

I am challenging this notice on the grounds that your signage was wholly inadequate and your demand does not represent a genuine pre-estimate of any loss. Nor was this a genuine offer of a contract. To be clear, there was no consideration flowing between us and certainly no acceptance on my part of an extortionate charge.

In this case, I am giving you a chance to cancel it, which will save you future postage to the USA. I have supplied my postal address so you can write to wish me a Merry Christmas if you want. I am not interested in the IAS because the smart advice tells me it's considered to be the laughing stock of online forums now they have sussed how it 'works'. I have been told that it is considered a worthless kangaroo court with 'decisions' made anonymously. Surely not - in the US that would not be allowed! Surely IPC members are a tad more professional that that? I suggest you cancel it forthwith, because I have made my decision that you have no case and you would be wasting your time writing to me.

You cannot obtain the data of the registered keeper as I have supplied my name and postal address, as driver. You will be immediately reported to the DVLA if you try.

For anything other than a cancellation, my charge is £100 per reply you send me, as consideration. Acceptance will be by performance.

Love & kisses (or however you wish to sign off)






If you have to post it, get free proof of posting from any local Post Office by asking the counter clerk for a 'certificate of posting'. DO NOT post 'signed-for' (as they won't)!

P.S. Understand fully that this is NOT a fine, must NOT be paid, does not affect you in any way, doesn't appear on any record except their own made up rubbish. But understand also that hire companies are useless at knowing the difference between this drivel and a real Council PCN (same acronym is used by the scammers). So you must write as driver, urgently, and keep proof of the appeal to be sure they cannot get the hire co. data from the DVLA in 28 days (by giving them the name & postal addy of the driver it leaves them stuffed. They cannot get the keeper data, they only have you to write to in the US).