really need advise - renting three bed, no loft insulation?

jc808

So youve rented an older property without confirming what the insulation is like

more fool you, in my opinion and something environmental dept at council shouldnt be getting involved in.

Major damp problems - yes they should be involved
no electrics or heating - yes they should be involved
major structural issues or infestation - yes they should be involved
insulation in one room not to modern standards, old house - im sure they have more pressing issues.

Why not move your child to other room and you sleep there?

posiepie

thanks jc really helpful

theartfullodger

All properties (private lets, council lets, housing association property, owner-occupied..) have to meet HHSRS standards:

These including cold & heating effectiveness...see..
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/housing-health-and-safety-rating-system-guidance-for-landlords-and-property-related-professionals

In particular

2.11 Low temperatures can impair the thermoregulatory system of the elderly, and the very
young whose thermoregulatory system is immature. Both these groups may spend a greater time indoors in cold weather and both will not move about as much as other groups in the cold.
&
2.19 Structural thermal insulation should be provided to minimise heat loss. The level of insulation necessary is in part dependent on geographical location and exposure,
position in relation to other dwellings and buildings, and orientation. South facing glazing can be used to increase solar heat gain and so save energy.
&
2.20 Heating should be controllable by the occupants, and safely and properly installed and maintained. It should be appropriate to the design, layout and construction, such that the whole of the dwelling can be adequately and efficiently heated.

Suggest you write (yes, WRITE! - keep copy) to landlord (yes, LANDLORD!, copy agent) noting concerns of cold & inadequate heating and ask what he will be doing about it, and that you would prefer to avoid inviting local council Environmental Health in for a HHSRS survey.

You may get promptly evicting using S21 (wrong, unfair, Thatcher's legacy..) so decide what is most important to you first...

Cheers!

Cautious_Optimist

deannatrois wrote: »

As you have inspected the loft to see that there is no insulation, I assume you can get into the loft to lay insulation rolls as we did? My smaller son's bedroom attic was enclosed (like a gable with its own enclosed roof space) so we did have to make a hole in the ceiling and put in a new ceiling because there was an additional problem as well - but hopefully you won't have to do all that. We did manage to get the LL to play for the plasterboard but we paid for everything else and did the work. But my son can now sleep in the bedroom thank goodness.

The solid brick walls need only applies if you want cavity wall insulation (which can cause as many problems as it solves so I didn't go this route.., google cavity wall insulation problems).

Just find out the cheapest way for you to buy/obtain insulation rolls and install them yourselves. You may be able to get one of the energy companies to do it for you if you have nothing in the loft (like rubble, past tenant storage items etc) but you can always do it yourself.

No, I think OP is talking about a "bedroom" in the loft.
It sounds like it doesn't conform to buildings regs...

Cautious_Optimist

jc808 wrote: »

So youve rented an older property without confirming what the insulation is like

more fool you, in my opinion and something environmental dept at council shouldnt be getting involved in.

Major damp problems - yes they should be involved
no electrics or heating - yes they should be involved
major structural issues or infestation - yes they should be involved
insulation in one room not to modern standards, old house - im sure they have more pressing issues.

Why not move your child to other room and you sleep there?

It sounds like this is actually a two bedroom house, with a loft room that is being used as a third bedroom.
Am I right?
If so, I doubt that it conforms to building regulations if it has no insulation above the loft room ceiling.

If windows have been put in the roof, then it may even be a breach of planning (as well as building) regulations...

It doesn't sound like this should have been let out as a three bedroom house. If it has, the LL and letting agent are at fault.

It probably should have been described as "two bedroom plus storage room in loft".

Are you claiming LHA for a three bedroom house?
If you are, then this MAY constitute fraud...

I would speak to Shelter ASAP.
From what you say, this LL sounds disreputable.
You won't be able to easily insulate a loft room like this, which is why it should have probably never have been constructed.

Lofts are best left as cold space voids.

Cautious_Optimist

Errata wrote: »

Ask the LL to repair the roof before the winter gales, rain and snow starts.

Definitely. ASAP.
Because your local roofers will get busier as the winter starts...

sandsni

I live in a very old house and in fairness it is possible to have small holes in tiles without it having any major effect. Are the holes significantly large (i.e. do they let in water when it rains)?


Could you and your husband move in to the loft room and allow your son a warmer room?


In the meantime you may need to bite the bullet and run your central heating a bit more/higher or put extra heaters in the room.

[Deleted User]

While we were doing my younger son's room (it did take some time) my son either slept on the sofa downstairs or in the main bedroom with us (my ex did live with me then, no connection to the breakup between us lol).

But I just hit a brick wall with my LL. There was an EPC report that said the house was fully insulated.., obviously not worth the paper it was written on. There was no access to the roof when I viewed and so moved in unaware there was a lack of insulation until it turned cold and we went in the roof space to investigate. I hardly think a tenant can be castigated for that (JC808).

When I contacted environmental health about this and other problems they didn't visit, they just wrote a vague letter to the LL which was worse than useless. Didn't get the repairs done, just got me an irate phone call from the LL and a threat of evicition. Environmental Health clearly were ineffective.

jc808

be aware that, depending on when the work was done, it may not be a case that it breaches Building regs

If it was done in the past few years, it doesnt comply.
If it was done twenty years ago, it might comply with rules in force at the time, or may be non-notifiable
If it was done in the 1930s, there was probably no need to notify anyone, adn no need to meet any regulations!

This is the problem with loft rooms and cellars and the like.
When was it done?

captainhindsight_2

You will not qualify for free loft insulation, as it is a room in a roof. What you need is room in roof insulation, which is different to loft insulation.

There has been Cashback for this in the past, and a new Cashback scheme has been announced yesterday so hopefully this will include Cashback for what you need. If it does, this should reduce the capital cost of having the work done, but will not make it free.

In regards to your landlords obligations regarding this, in have no idea.

From 2016" you are able to ask your landlord to install recommendations made on the Epc and cannot be reasonably refused but that is obviously some time away.