help me help a friend please

bylromarha

Really, it is a friend! We'll call her Kim.

Kim divorced OH 3 years ago after 16 years of marriage. OH was physically abusive for 9 years, they split up, got back together after he promised to change. He never physically hurt her again, but emotionally abused her instead.

He is king of charm to all around him - even to the extent Kim's family cannot understand the divorce.

They had twins - now 5 years old. OH collects them for his weekends and obviously favours 1 over the other. He yells and shouts at 1 twin in front of Kim, often leaving the twin with her as he drives off - due to simple things like shoes not being put on quickly enough. He often says how much favoured twin is going to be treated to ice creams and the like before he drives off.

OH still tries to exert his control by saying specific pieces of clothing must be packed and that he will be dropping twins off "at some point" on Sundays.

Kim is still trying to keep the twins relationship with dad going as long as possible as she thinks its important. She hates how he speaks to and treats the twin, but still encourages her to go and spend time with dad. The twin has become uber clingy in the past month and wont let mum out of sight, except for school.

I've tried to encourage her that it isn't healthy and she should maybe consider not letting him see the twins. She's concerned things will get worse if she stops allowing him to see them.

I've suggested she keep a book that logs incidents she witnesses. Also that she gets twins to draw pictures of time spent at daddies, just to see what comes out of it, as the twins just don't talk about their time at dads (which I suspect is due to the childs way of protecting mum and her feelings)

So what would you advise Kim to do? Stopping contact isn't an option in her opinion as he speaks terribly, but not enough for SS to care, so she can't do anything formally. And he'll turn on the charm if they go down the legal route.

So how can I help her? What would you suggest?

Any opinions welcome please.

JoW123

bylromarha wrote: »

Really, it is a friend! We'll call her Kim.

Kim divorced OH 3 years ago after 16 years of marriage. OH was physically abusive for 9 years, they split up, got back together after he promised to change. He never physically hurt her again, but emotionally abused her instead.

He is king of charm to all around him - even to the extent Kim's family cannot understand the divorce.

They had twins - now 5 years old. OH collects them for his weekends and obviously favours 1 over the other. He yells and shouts at 1 twin in front of Kim, often leaving the twin with her as he drives off - due to simple things like shoes not being put on quickly enough. He often says how much favoured twin is going to be treated to ice creams and the like before he drives off.

OH still tries to exert his control by saying specific pieces of clothing must be packed and that he will be dropping twins off "at some point" on Sundays.

Kim is still trying to keep the twins relationship with dad going as long as possible as she thinks its important. She hates how he speaks to and treats the twin, but still encourages her to go and spend time with dad. The twin has become uber clingy in the past month and wont let mum out of sight, except for school.

I've tried to encourage her that it isn't healthy and she should maybe consider not letting him see the twins. She's concerned things will get worse if she stops allowing him to see them.

I've suggested she keep a book that logs incidents she witnesses. Also that she gets twins to draw pictures of time spent at daddies, just to see what comes out of it, as the twins just don't talk about their time at dads (which I suspect is due to the childs way of protecting mum and her feelings)

So what would you advise Kim to do? Stopping contact isn't an option in her opinion as he speaks terribly, but not enough for SS to care, so she can't do anything formally. And he'll turn on the charm if they go down the legal route.

So how can I help her? What would you suggest?

Any opinions welcome please.

Can I ask a few questions before responding?


1) Are the twins both girls or is the favoured twin a boy?


2) Has he always favoured the one twin over the other?


3) When he asks for specific items of clothing does is it 'can you send the kids with their wellies cos we are going to the park' or 'I expect the blue top from next, the navy trousers etc?


4) How does the supposedly favoured twin react when the sister is left behind?


The answers will affect the advice I would give.

Stevie_Palimo

Wow what a sad man he is and seems to need some specialist help in my view and maybe a stint in a mental health unit.

Better_Days

Is Kim's OH a Narcissist?

http://www.bandbacktogether.com/adult-children-of-Narcissistic-parents-resources/

If so the 'Golden Child' - 'Scapegoat' dynamic may well be going on.

http://www.daughtersofnarcissisticmothers.com/golden-child-scapegoat.html

If so, very damaging to both children (I have personal experience) and in the long run the 'Golden Child' may suffer more a their personality is subsumed by their narcissistic parent.

If Kim is up against Narcissism she has a long hard road ahead of her to protect her twins, narcissists are often charmers and it can be very difficult to persuade others of the reality of their behaviours.

There is lots of info online about adult children of narcissists (although mostly narcissistic mothers) which may be a good starting point for Kim. Here's an article I found about narcissistic fathers http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-intelligent-divorce/201303/the-narcissistic-father

And co-parenting with a narcissist (an American site but does have useful advice) http://divorcedmoms.com/articles/coparenting-with-a-narcissist-what-to-do-when-your-children-are-being-emotionally-abused-

Loanranger

I totally agree with the personality disorder suggestion.
Your friend should not allow the parent to continue to emotionally abuse this child. She will be exposing the child to a lifetime of abuse. People with personality disorders rarely admit they have a problem thus refuse offers of help so it's a vain hope that the parent will change.
I have experience of this in my own extended family over a 50 year period and it's not good outcome usually.
Also, the twins are learning bad behaviour from their father.

pollypenny

Absolutely agree with the above. This poor child is being abused.

Recording every incident is a start, then maybe legal advice to prevent the bully seeing both twins, unless supervised.

bylromarha

JoW123 wrote: »

Can I ask a few questions before responding?


1) Are the twins both girls or is the favoured twin a boy? Both girls


2) Has he always favoured the one twin over the other? No, only developed in the past 2 years as the girls have grown.


3) When he asks for specific items of clothing does is it 'can you send the kids with their wellies cos we are going to the park' or 'I expect the blue top from next, the navy trousers etc? I expect the blue top from next, the navy trousers


4) How does the supposedly favoured twin react when the sister is left behind? Unknown as twin is with dad then. Mum says her face looks like she just accepts that how it is as she is driven off. Favoured twin has been overheard consoling other crying twin with phrases like "don't worry, I'll look after you at daddy's" Favoured twin has also pretended to be other twin on the phone in order to shoulder some of the flack her sister gets. Dad couldn't tell the difference in their voices and tones, and was taken in. Mum listening in on the phone call didn't want to tell favoured twin off on the phone for doing it or let on to dad what had happened, but had a chat with daughter afterwards about lying.


The answers will affect the advice I would give.

here's my 10 characters

Errata

I'm in no position to diagnose remotely if the OH has a health problem or not; nor is anyone else.
The friend is responsible for protecting her children from abuse - both the twin that's being verbally abused and the twin that witnesses it. She either accepts that responsibility and takes appropriate action or not. It's her choice.

JoW123

Thank you for the answers to my questions above (I can't quote the post) Given the replies I would stop him seeing both twins asap because he is abusing both of them and potentially causing so many issues in the future for both of them. I'm really sorry but I would also question why he wants the 'favoured twin' to himself without her sister there. I know that sounds horrible but there is so much about that behaviour that is wrong. I questioned whether one twin was a boy because I wondered if he had an issue with women/girls because of the physical/emotional abuse mentioned to Kim or simply whether in some misguided way he related better to the boy, but because that's not the case I think Kim needs to take action

bylromarha

So how to convince someone that the relatively minor behaviour she sees (in SS eyes) is enough to rethink how girls visit dad?

Mojisola

bylromarha wrote: »

Favoured twin has also pretended to be other twin on the phone in order to shoulder some of the flack her sister gets. Dad couldn't tell the difference in their voices and tones, and was taken in. Mum listening in on the phone call didn't want to tell favoured twin off on the phone for doing it or let on to dad what had happened, but had a chat with daughter afterwards about lying.:D

There are times when lying is perfectly acceptable and, for me, this would be one of them.