Third party attempting to recover "debt" for PPC - 28 day limit still applicable?

stargazer7

Hi all,

Just wondering if you could advise on the following please :

My girlfriend was given a ticket for parking in a store car park (which was free, but apparently for customers only but that's probably beside the point). She got a windscreen notice and I advised her not to respond until a letter came through to the registered keeper. When this arrived, I advised her of the procedure I've followed, ie soft appeal, get a POPLA code, POPLA appeal.

However, when the letter arrived, it was from a company called "Parking Debt Collectors" claiming to be acting on behalf of the PPC. We responded using the usual soft appeal points but they are claiming they are only "authorised to collect monies" - despite having an appeals section on their website. They are basically telling her she has to contact the PPC with these same points.

She can of course, reply with the same soft appeal to the PPC. The only issue is that in the time they have taken to reply, more than 28 days have elapsed since the date of their original letter (the timing of this is probably not coincidental!).

So, my question is, have we missed the boat to make a POPLA appeal now? Would it be deemed reasonable for them to claim they are acting on behalf of their client, and give details of their own appeals procedure, yet refer her back to the client in what seems to be a timewasting exercise when the appeal is made?

It just seems like they are trying to confuse the issue by creating two points of contact instead of one.

Any advice gratefully received!

bod1467

If the first notification was from a debt collector, then either THAT is the notice to keeper, or there has not yet been ANY notice to keeper.

Treat the DC letter as the NtK and send the appeal to the PPC, making it clear that there has been NO NtK from them so the DC letter is being treated as such.

Which PPC is this? (From the windscreen ticket).

Guys_Dad

To enable us to help, give us a few dates.

Date of contravention.
Date of letter from Parking Debt Collectors.
Who was the PPC? (Important !)

stargazer7

It's JAS Parking Solutions.

Do you mean the original letter or the most recent one from PDC? If the original, won't they just be able to claim that the 28 days to appeal is now up?

Guys_Dad

You may not have been clear in your opening paragraphs. It reads as if the first letter received was from the debt company

" She got a windscreen notice and I advised her not to respond until a letter came through to the registered keeper. When this arrived, I advised her of the procedure I've followed, ie soft appeal, get a POPLA code, POPLA appeal. However, when the letter arrived, it was from a company called "Parking Debt Collectors" claiming to be acting on behalf of the PPC."

To make it simple,
give the dates of all correspondence and date of contravention and we can target advice.

Redx

JAS dont send the NTK normally, it tells you this in the newbies thread and clearly states to appeal to JAS direct after day 21 from a windscreen notice

obviously you cannot appeal to the debt collectors who do the back office work after 28 days, so send the soft appeal to JAS on their website or by post, and complain to the BPA about no NTK and being chased by debt collectors too (see post #6 of the newbies thread) giving the BPA copies of all paperwork, a time line etc too (and any copies of the proof of posting)

the silly thing was waiting for the NTK when the newbies thread clearly says appeal after day 21

stargazer7

OK, I didn't see the updates to the newbies thread which has been updated since last time I read it and so didn't realise there was an exception for JAS. I appreciate any advice that is offered, but it's important to remember that sometimes people make mistakes, especially when they have a lot on their plate. I don't think there's any need to take such a patronising tone.

"Obviously you can't appeal to the debt collectors" - OK, so why do they have an "appeals" section on their website? Their letter clearly states that "all queries relating to this letter" should be directed to them. She is replying as the registered keeper, who has not necessarily received anything from JAS. It seems logical to me that if somebody writes to you claiming to be acting on behalf of a client that the company who issued this letter become the point of contact. As I say, I think this is a deliberate tactic on their behalf, designed to cause confusion.

Just to be clear, ALL correspondence received through the post has been from Parking Debt Collectors, not JAS.

Dates :

"contravention" 09/06/14
letter from PDC 03/09/14
response to PDC 10/09/14
reply from PDC 03/10/14 (but dated 17/09/14!)
they have also sent a letter entitled "Reminder - Notice to Keeper" which arrived the same day 03/10/14

Thanks for your help.

The_Slithy_Tove

stargazer7 wrote: »

"Obviously you can't appeal to the debt collectors" - OK, so why do they have an "appeals" section on their website? Their letter clearly states that "all queries relating to this letter" should be directed to them.

That's easy to answer. All you need to do is remember the whole thing is a SCAM dressed up to look like it has some legitimacy (which it doesn't). You don't seriously thing that a debt collector really manages a proper appeals system, do you?

Redx

stargazer7 wrote: »

As I say, I think this is a deliberate tactic on their behalf, designed to cause confusion.

Just to be clear, ALL correspondence received through the post has been from Parking Debt Collectors, not JAS.

Dates :

"contravention" 09/06/14
letter from PDC 03/09/14
response to PDC 10/09/14
reply from PDC 03/10/14 (but dated 17/09/14!)
they have also sent a letter entitled "Reminder - Notice to Keeper" which arrived the same day 03/10/14

Thanks for your help.

got it in one !!!

the debt collectors etc do all the "back office work" as they dont want all the hassle of dealing with it and also hope you will "cave in" and pay, all explained by coupon mad in that sticky thread, which is why she says appeal after day 21 from the windscreen ticket to stop all this silliness designed to confuse people

there is an ethical logical method of doing this, which JAS dont bother with , they take the lets not make it easy route, lets mess people about and dont bother with the NTK between day 29 and 56 , lets use the debt collector route after day 28

only jas can consider the appeal, jas should send the NTK but dont, only jas can issue the popla code, jas are the ones who initiated the "invoice" (windscreen ticket), so the rule is only deal with JAS, not the debt collectors ( and all the others coupon-mad mentiones in that sticky thread as being small time couldnt care less , lets pass it onto somebody else after 28 days , parking companies)

the only thing the debt collectors want and need is for the gullible to pay up, and then they get their fee , nothing else matters to them

Coupon-mad

Hang on - if PDC sent what looks like a 'Notice to Keeper' then you did right to appeal to whoever they said the keeper could appeal to. Was it a NTK, did it talk about the PCN and then say 'the driver didn't pay so we have obtained your details as keeper and if you don't pay or appeal'...etc? This is just like the method run by PCS when they send a NTK, but at least PCS actually reply properly(ish) to an appeal and people get a POPLA code from them.

You CAN Appeal to a debt collector if the debt collector issued a NTK (first letter) stating appeals go to them.

Complain to the BPA by email explaining this but NOT talking about who was driving. Don't even mention the PCN on the windscreen nor 'waiting' for a letter! Say this:

I received what seems to be a Notice to Keeper from a company called "Parking Debt Collectors" claiming to be acting on behalf of an AOS member. I am the registered keeper and I responded with an appeal. But they replied, claiming they are only "authorised to collect monies" - despite having an appeals section on their website and despite them issuing the Notice to me. I had received no letters prior to this so I appealed in good faith. They are basically telling me that I have to contact the Operator with these same points. The only issue is that in the time they have taken to reply, more than 28 days have elapsed since the date of their original letter (the timing of this is probably not coincidental). So as keeper they have left me without an appeal route and have not offered POPLA. The PPC is apparently ......... {{add crap name ParkingfineRipOffsRus or whoever is named on the letter from PDC, and remove this sentence!}} so please investigate why they are breaching the BPA Code of Practice by not allowing a keeper to appeal as they should. I require a POPLA code or cancellation of the alleged PCN mentioned in the letter. I was not driving so this was my first chance to appeal.


Obviously only complain to the BPA if this is a BPA member firm PPC. If it's an IPC member you would have to complain to the IPC. Who is the PPC?

bod1467

Post #4 tells us it was JAS Parking.