Insurance mess...advice please

Car_54

sam1970 wrote: »

Unfortunately I cant find any paper work for the hire car(there was not many anyway..just one page my wife signed to show the condition of the car when we got it). What happened was that our insurance phoned us to say that their approved garage will collect our car on xx day and give us Ford Ka..we said it was too small for our needs..they said no problem as the accident was not our fault we can go for a bigger car and they will recover the cost from the other insurer. couple of hours later we received a phone call from the hire company saying that they have a car for us as instructed by our insurer.

The insurer will almost certainly have recorded the phone call. If they prove difficult about the car hire, ask them for a transcript of the recording, to back up your complaint.

AdrianC

tykesi wrote: »

I'd be very sure of what you were provided with before even complaining to the insurer never mind the ombudsman.

You don't know on what basis the larger car was provided (credit hire etc) so you need to have all the facts before you go stamping your feet at anyone otherwise you'll be laughed out of the room!

This. With bells on.

It sounds very much as if you were pushed towards an Accident Management Company - have a google for that phrase. Basically, they provide you a hire car "paid for by the other company's insurance" (but only if they admit liability). If they don't, then you get the bill for it. That's the way they work. If the other driver ISN'T liable, why would they pay for your hire car? If that's what happened, then you will have signed a contract agreeing to that.

Quentin

All this sounds like the repair and the car hire maybe weren't provided by the insurer, but a separate credit hire/repair claim management operation. If so, usually you aren't liable whatever the outcome provided you told the truth regarding the incident.


You do need to get the paperwork for the car hire - maybe the car hire garage will supply you a copy.


Regarding the ombudsman, before taking this there you need to go through the insurers formal complaints procedure. This will be set out in the policy document.

InsideInsurance

sam1970 wrote: »

we can go for a bigger car and they will recover the cost from the other insurer. couple of hours later we received a phone call from the hire company saying that they have a car for us as instructed by our insurer.

Did they clarify which "they" they meant? Did they say, "they will recover the cost" or "we will recover the cost"? The former suggests your insurers were suggesting credit hire.

I do understand remembering a conversation verbatim is difficult but these things do become important and people often are given right information but miss understand it because its not something they've had to deal with before.

sam1970 wrote: »

just one page my wife signed to show the condition of the car when we got it

You need to find that document, normally its got a credit agreement on the rear - but this statement also flies in the face of you saying you didnt sign for anything

Because of the credit element and they dont always recover prices are normally 2-3 times the normal day rate for mainstream companies and there are a few "specialist" ones that only provide luxury vehicles or odd commercial vehicles and they have an even higher multiple

You do need to speak to your insurers and find out exactly if the repairs and/ or hire were done on a credit basis.

sam1970

i phoned the car hire company (their office is down the road from my house) and they said the cost for our 3 weeks hire was just over £600 (so normal rate) and all paid by our insurer. So clearly our insurer was confident that they will recover their loses from the other insurer based on their communication...why should I pay the cost for their incompetence?

Quentin

Clearly something came to light about the claim that changed minds!


As has been posted, you need to see what you signed. Ask for a copy of the agreement.

sam1970

I am not sure what agreement you guys refer to? The insurer told us over the phone that they will arrange the hire car so we did not sign any thing. We went to the hire company office after they phoned us, they said every thing was sorted out by our insurer, checked driving license and then we signed a paper to show the condition of the car (had a copy of that but lost it..dont think it is important because it is fairly standard for all car hire companies with a diagram of the car), suggested we pay £100 excess waiver which we agreed to and paid...Three weeks later they came and collected the hire car from our house after we got our car back..we did not exchange or sign any documents..the guy knoked on the door..we gave him the key and he went..did not even bother checking the car

Tilt

The hire car should of come with a rental agreement (even though you wern't paying for it). Apart from anything else it provides proof that you are legally entitled to drive the car.

That aside, I think the whole thing stinks. I can't see how legally the insurers can "change" their minds after confirming to you that your car hire will be paid by them. As someone has already said, there should be a recording of all your telephone conversations with them so I would be asking for a copy of this with the view of taking legal advice.

InsideInsurance

sam1970 wrote: »

I am not sure what agreement you guys refer to? The insurer told us over the phone that they will arrange the hire car so we did not sign any thing. We went to the hire company office after they phoned us, they said every thing was sorted out by our insurer, checked driving license and then we signed a paper to show the condition of the car

In the normal course of action for these circumstances an insurer will offer to pass your details to a hire company (eg Enterprise, HelpHire, Albany, CCL etc) and tell you the hire company will be in contact.

When the hire car company gives you the car you sign a document, part of that document is a vehicle inspection, part of it is about insurance and part of it is a credit agreement. Normally the credit agreement element is on the back of the form. The front where you sign will say you agree to whats on the back.

Even if it isnt credit hire other things will be on there as the insurer will not want to be liable if you refuse to give the car back for another week after they terminate hire or for damage that you cause to the hire vehicle.

At the end of the hire the company then attempts to recover the hire costs from the third party insurer, not your insurer.

Periodically your insurer then receives a nice cheque for all the referrals they've given the hire car company and/ or get preferential rates on hire provided under the terms of the policy as part of an enhanced or guaranteed hire/courtesy car policy extension. Normally they prefer the cheque for a variety of reasons.

sam1970

InsideInsurance wrote: »

In the normal course of action for these circumstances an insurer will offer to pass your details to a hire company (eg Enterprise, HelpHire, Albany, CCL etc) and tell you the hire company will be in contact.

When the hire car company gives you the car you sign a document, part of that document is a vehicle inspection, part of it is about insurance and part of it is a credit agreement. Normally the credit agreement element is on the back of the form. The front where you sign will say you agree to whats on the back.

Even if it isnt credit hire other things will be on there as the insurer will not want to be liable if you refuse to give the car back for another week after they terminate hire or for damage that you cause to the hire vehicle.

At the end of the hire the company then attempts to recover the hire costs from the third party insurer, not your insurer.

Periodically your insurer then receives a nice cheque for all the referrals they've given the hire car company and/ or get preferential rates on hire provided under the terms of the policy as part of an enhanced or guaranteed hire/courtesy car policy extension. Normally they prefer the cheque for a variety of reasons.

So considering that the whole matter happened nearly 16 months ago does that mean that the hire company had their money? and from who?