Orange coverage stopped working in my area

Old_Gold

Human_Writes wrote: »

I'd bet you aren't entitled to compensation, the terms of the contract they have agreed with Orange is clear on this point.

3 PROVISION OF SERVICES

3.1what we aim to provide in the UK
We will take all reasonable steps to make the Services available to you at all times. The Services are only available within the range of the base stations that make up our Network. We cannot guarantee a continuous fault free service.

Please note that:

3.1.1the quality and availability of Services may sometimes be affected by factors outside our control - such as local physical obstructions, atmospheric conditions, other causes of radio interference, features or functionality of your Device, the number of people trying to use the network at the same time, and faults in other telecommunication networks to which the Network is connected.

3.4 Services may sometimes be affected by maintenance and upgrading
The Network and the Services may from time to time require upgrading, modification, maintenance or other works. These may result in some or all of the Services becoming temporarily unavailable. In such cases, we'll do everything we can to keep the period of non-availability to a minimum.However, some interruption may be inevitable.

4 YOUR RIGHTS TO TERMINATE THIS CONTRACT 4.1 terminating your Contract after the Minimum Term
You may terminate your Contract to expire at anytime after the Minimum Term by giving us at least one month's notice. You are free to restore your Contract throughout this notice period, should you change your mind.

4.2 terminating your Contract during the Minimum Term

You may terminate your Contract before the Minimum Term has expired if you pay us:

4.2.1all Charges that are due, plus4.2.2a lump sum equivalent to the total of all the monthly or other periodic Charges still remaining on your initial Minimum Term agreement (except in the circumstances set out in Conditions 4.3 and 15.1). You'll be entitled to a rebate of 5% of that total if you terminate your Contract up to and including the first day of the last month of the Minimum Term.

4.4 terminating your contract because Orange is no longer able to provide access to the Network

If, for reasons beyond our control, we are no longer able to provide Network Services, we will at our discretion either:
4.4.1 make arrangements for you to be supplied with equivalent Services by another network at no extra cost to you, or

4.4.2 accept written notice from you that you wish to terminate your Contract. In such cases we will refund any pre-paid Charges that have not been used up.

18 LIABILITY

18.1circumstances in which neither of us accepts liability
Except as provided in this Condition 18, neither party shall be liable to the other, whether in contract or tort nor otherwise, for any loss or damage which is:

a) not the fault of the other party
b) indirect and/or not reasonably foreseeable
c) loss of business, profits, savings, revenue, use or goodwill, or for any loss or corruption of data whether caused to the other party through any breach of your Contract or any matters arising under it. Neither party excludes liability for negligent acts or omissions causing death or personal injury to any person....

18.3 factors beyond our control
We will not be liable to you if we are unable to perform an obligation or provide the Services to you because of any factor outside our control, including but not limited to Acts of God, industrial action, default or failure of a third party, war, terrorist act, governmental action, or by any act or decision made by a court of competent jurisdiction.

The contract seems explicit in relation to this point, Orange are not liable for an act of god that is not reasonably forseeable. Orange could also argue that they provide a mobile phone network to thousands of miles of the country so they can clearly provide you with access to the network elsewhere so 4.4 would not apply. You also accepted that some interuption in service was to be expected when you accepted the contract.

They might offer something as goodwill, for example line rental charges back, but they'd be under no obligation to offer anything under the terms of the contract.

I think especially 4.4 would be interesting in a court of law.
The contract does not give the provider a right to charge if it cannot provide the service. I think a judge might be very sympathetic if someone claimed that their use of the phone was from a certain place and therefore they could not get enjoyment because of failure to provide. Do you really think that an executive of a phone company would want to go to law rather than give a goodwill gesture. Maybe a customer service operator would argue the toss but not a senior executive.

skitsue

Hi, my husband is a self employed courier who relies on his mobile for all his business, (we do not have a business account with Orange) The coverage in our home is nearly no existent, Orange say there is no problem, if i can prove i cant use my service as intended (no point in haveing a mobile if i cant use it) could I cancle, the contract i signed is not being forfilled if my service is as they say "pants"

Old_Gold

Skitsue the basic premise is if you dont ask you dont get. If you hadn't checked in the first case about coverage of your area that may go against you but if you were told there would be coverage you should have a case. The interesting thing that you wrote is that Orange say there is no problem.
I know when I am at my Mother's flat there is normally no signal unless I go to the window and hang out at a 33 degree angle. Also it appears that there is signal near the Pinner area.

Human_Writes

Old_Gold wrote: »

I think especially 4.4 would be interesting in a court of law.
The contract does not give the provider a right to charge if it cannot provide the service. I think a judge might be very sympathetic if someone claimed that their use of the phone was from a certain place and therefore they could not get enjoyment because of failure to provide. Do you really think that an executive of a phone company would want to go to law rather than give a goodwill gesture. Maybe a customer service operator would argue the toss but not a senior executive.

I think the point is more the one I was making, it's a mobile phone! They provide you with a network of interconnected masts covering most of the country which is the service they charge you for, if it doesn't work in one area, walk half a mile up the road and it'll pick up signal so you can still access their services. I think a judge would be more inclined to be sympathetic to the companies point of view than you think. The contract is the terms under which the company have agreed to provide you with service, a judge would have to give consideration to this before issuing a judgement.

A localised fault with one mast clearly doesn't invalidate a mobile phone contract, especially when you've agreed that your service will in all likelihood be interupted and the network never guarenteed it would work in your home in the first place. Also you still are able to access their services from pretty much everywhere else in the entire country. Attempting to argue that the contract for provision of access to telephone services over much of the country is invalid on the grounds of a single localised problem in front of a judge would in my opinion get you nothing and nowhere! All the network would have to do is submit a two or three paragraph written Defence with a copy of their terms and conditions and in all likelihood they would win a county court claim!

Regarding your comments on a senior executive, your chances of speaking to a senior executive at Orange or most other companies is slim to none, they have far better things to do than speak to customers, things like running the company. All an email to the the executive office would get you is a callback from an experienced member of their customer service staff, I have spoken with this office on several occassions in the past and they are customer service representatives, one of them even admitted to me that get paid no more than anyone else in Customer Services and had only met the Chief Executive, the person they purport to represent on one occassion! They may offer you a credit of some or all of your line rental charges from a customer service point of view, but as I pointed out, the contract a customer agrees too does not entitle them to a penny in compensation for loss of service in the circumstances reported by the first poster.

Skitsue, you could try and see how you get on as suggested.

skintscotsman

i laugh at how the minnows try to take on the big companies. look minnows, the big companies don't give a hoot about you, their T&Cs are there to protect themselves and NOT the consumer.

THey factor in to their budgets the fact that they'll have to give £50 goodwill gestures from time to time so, really, that's the best you're going to get and even then you'll need to escalate the call to someone with more seniority than a Cusotmer Service Advisor or their Team Leaders.

Old_Gold

Absolutely I agree with both of the above posts which is a sad state of affairs. The customer has very little rights without a major fight these days.
We have given away our rights very easily and ironically at a time when we have more media information we have a climate of non care of the customer. Vive le revolution.

skintscotsman

Totally - unless the minnow is well versed in consumer law, they don't stand a chance! And, in fact, if the minnow is well versed in consumer law then they won't be a minnow! (Does that make sense!?!?!)