defibulator

PenguinJim

Taggo wrote: »

Liquids an metals straightforward. The gases I assume they mean oxygen, cylinders should be moved away while delivering a shock.

To remove all gases from the area I was picturing moving the patient into a vacuum chamber, naturally. Or quickly flying them into space.

*max*

It's called a defibrillator. I think being able to spell the name of the thing should be an indication on the potential ability to use (or misuse) it. For "everyday people" with no known history, it's much more useful to learn CPR properly than to try and rely on a machine that nobody is 1/ going to think about using in the heat of the moment, nor 2/ going to know how to use in those same circumstances.

Richard53

I agree with all of the above. Learn how to do CPR if there is someone in your family who might need it, and then think about a defibrillator (or AED) as an added extra. The modern ones intended for general use (we have two in work) are foolproof and could be used by a child. Open it up and listen to the instructions - ours even gives you the correct rhythm for the chest compressions. And it is safe - if there is no need for a shock, the machine will not deliver one.


But to be honest, using a defib is a last resort. Proper CPR administered in good time is more likely to help the patient to survive.


And just to debunk a myth: a defib won't restart a stopped heart. If a heart is in ventricular fibrillation, the defib will actually stop the heart. The idea is that the heart will start beating again all by itself, but in its natural rhythm. Or so the trainer told me when I did my last refresher. I have only ever used one in a training situation.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_external_defibrillator

Person_one

*max* wrote: »

It's called a defibrillator. I think being able to spell the name of the thing should be an indication on the potential ability to use (or misuse) it. For "everyday people" with no known history, it's much more useful to learn CPR properly than to try and rely on a machine that nobody is 1/ going to think about using in the heat of the moment, nor 2/ going to know how to use in those same circumstances.

I agree that learning CPR and some basic first aid is far more useful than buying a defib, however, if somebody does arrest in public and there is one nearby, it's never a bad idea to get it out and have a go, trained or not. You're not going to make their situation any worse by doing so.

http://www.resus.org.uk/pages/aed.pdf

pmarsh1986

I am a nurse and have been for 10 years. I don't watch medical dramas for their poor portrayal of defib use. That and how patients in intensive care are often left alone in a side room with no staff visible for miles. :mad:) There are only two very specific heart rhythms which a defibrillator is useful in treating. In my career, I have used a defibrillator once for someone in ventricular fibrillation. I however have done CPR countless times which may be a more useful skill to have.

barbiedoll

I do first-aid training every year at work and CPR really is a life-saver but it is bloody hard work. Get yourself and the family trained, if you ever need to do it, you can have a back-up to help you!

I have never thought of keeping a defib at home but I do keep a pack of 300mg aspirin tablets in my medicine cabinet....just in case!

http://www.bhf.org.uk/heart-health/conditions/heart-attack.aspx

FBaby

I genuinely don't understand the connection between having a large family and a defibrillator...?!

Same here. Unless this means three set of third generation, or a bad gene that affect the heart, I find it very odd to consider having such a device at home just because you have a large family.

Person_one

pmarsh1986 wrote: »

I am a nurse and have been for 10 years. I don't watch medical dramas for their poor portrayal of defib use. That and how patients in intensive care are often left alone in a side room with no staff visible for miles. :mad:) There are only two very specific heart rhythms which a defibrillator is useful in treating. In my career, I have used a defibrillator once for someone in ventricular fibrillation. I however have done CPR countless times which may be a more useful skill to have.

For those two heart rhythms though a defib is really your only chance. It is life saving, no question

You're absolutely right that good CPR is the most important skill, but having more AEDs in public places, and encouraging people to grab them and turn them on if they witness an arrest is not a bad idea at all! I love seeing them in shopping centres and so on.

pmarsh1986

Person_one wrote: »

For those two heart rhythms though a defib is really your only chance. It is life saving, no question

You're absolutely right that good CPR is the most important skill, but having more AEDs in public places, and encouraging people to grab them and turn them on if they witness an arrest is not a bad idea at all! I love seeing them in shopping centres and so on.

Absolutely but you are more likely to need CPR rather than having to use an AED. Good, proper and quickly started CPR will save more lives than defibbing IMO. The defib is given too much focus as a 'life saver' especially in hospital programmes. Let's just shock them and they will be sitting up with a cup of tea just directly!! Indeed, even witnessed in-hospital 'arrests' have poor outcomes.

For those at shopping centres etc - absolutely! But they'll be properly trained, calibrated, checked and have the additional CPR training. My colleague's best friend's son had a sudden death attributed to a chaotic rhythm and raises funds for AEDs (and the training in them) to local schools. Brilliant!

My main fear of having an AED at home is that there is a requirement for regular training and the regular checks/calibration of the AED. Although in my unit we don't have an AED (ours is manual although does have an AED function) we do a systems check every day and medical physics overhaul 6 monthly. Is that feasible in a home environment?

To the OP - get all your family to go to a CPR/first aid course as that will be more worthwhile to you and yours in my opinion.

Person_one

The AEDs in public places don't need any training though. Better if someone who has a bit of an idea uses it, but if someone has had a cardiac arrest, any random untrained person opening up the defib bag and following the very clear instructions is worthwhile. It's never going to make the situation worse!

Everybody should know basic CPR, of course, and there should also be loads of defibs around so that there's a reasonable chance of grabbing one if the need arises!