PPI Sars, Are Banks withholding information?

hotlioness

I've been chasing PPI's for some months now. Original SARs requests sent in March to 3 bank. The Banks have sent transaction history as far as I am aware instead of a SAR. There are no destruction documents and they aren't showing loans pre 1999 but no destruction certificates. There was well over £150,000 in loans and up to date Danske have offered £1000 PPI refund for one loan. Do banks try it on and just send selective transaction history to suit themselves? All 3 banks have done this. I had one bank say there was no evidence of a £20,000 loan, sent transaction history NOT showing the £20,000. I emailed saying I requested SARs, not transaction history and as they have exceeded there 40 day timeframe they will be reported to the ICO... The following day a statement came showing the £20,000.. but no PPI! They are also stating there is no PPI on the mortgage but they cannot show a printout to prove it as it has other customers names on. I'm losing the will and tempted to use a PPI Company to chase the remaining debts. All I want is A SAR... PEOPLE BEWARE, SELECTIVE TRANSACTION HISTORY IS NOT A SUBJECT ACCESS REPORT. During my experience all banks seem to be very deceptive. Any advice welcome

dunstonh

There are no destruction documents and they aren't showing loans pre 1999 but no destruction certificates.

You wouldn't expect to see that much of the time. Electronic data would just drop off and paper records would end up in a non-relevant filing system to be destroyed.

Do banks try it on and just send selective transaction history to suit themselves?

No. However, there is a misconception about what people will get back when they do a SAR. Plus, the further back you go, the harder it is to link records. Documents in manual filing cabinets frequently end up misfiled or in tatters with bits missing which could be located later. One clerk may just check your file whilst another could check a couple either side and find a misfiled doc.

They are also stating there is no PPI on the mortgage but they cannot show a printout to prove it as it has other customers names on.

They dont have to prove you didnt have it.

I'm losing the will and tempted to use a PPI Company to chase the remaining debts.

How will a claims company help you? What you want and what they do are two different things.

hotlioness

The £20,000 was not pre computers, it was 2007, the information they originally sent just happened to not have that information on until I complained. What should a SAR look like? There was no information pre 1999, it was just statements that began in 1999. How would I know the difference between a SAR and just transaction history? I was speaking to a friend who worked for a PPI company and she said the banks often do this, they don't send a SAR out but people aren't clued up to know the difference, plus she said often they don't show PPI's on statements as a separate payment, it won't be until you have the SAR that they will show

hotlioness

Also, surely they should have sent all copied mortgage documents that were signed, including any insurance documents signed, not just transaction history? the mortgage was only taken out 5 years ago. I feel that I am missing lots of information that could be relevant

dunstonh

The £20,000 was not pre computers, it was 2007, the information they originally sent just happened to not have that information on until I complained.

And they still cull data on computers.

What should a SAR look like?

A copy of what they have to view. A screenshot maybe. A copy of a microfiche printout. A copy of the document if paper.

How would I know the difference between a SAR and just transaction history?

A SAR is not physical thing. It is a request. The documents are unlikely to be the consumer facing statements but the in-house transaction history for example (i.e. less info).

I was speaking to a friend who worked for a PPI company and she said the banks often do this, they don't send a SAR out but people aren't clued up to know the difference, plus she said often they don't show PPI's on statements as a separate payment, it won't be until you have the SAR that they will show

I suspect you are putting too much weight on what your friend is saying. I am the data protection controller for my company so I probably know more than her. You dont send a SAR out. You send copies of what you have out and only copies of things stored on a relevant filing system. Not those things stored in other areas.

PPI does normally appear on the statement. If you think about it logically, how else would the amount increase if there isnt a transaction to increase it. A very small number of cases may see the amount being borrowed increased to include the premium though.

Also, surely they should have sent all copied mortgage documents that were signed, including any insurance documents signed, not just transaction history? the mortgage was only taken out 5 years ago. I feel that I am missing lots of information that could be relevant

They should send what they have in a relevant filing system. If the mortgage was only taken out 5 years ago then surely you would know what insurances you had. Maybe the lender didnt arrange the insurance. Maybe there isnt any insurance (and you should know if there is as that is one of the reason most mortgage PPI complaints get rejected).

You do realise that you dont need to do a SAR to make a complaint. In most cases, SARs yield no information to help you in your complaint.

-taff

hotlioness wrote: »

I was speaking to a friend who worked for a PPI company and she said the banks often do this, they don't send a SAR out but people aren't clued up to know the difference, plus she said often they don't show PPI's on statements as a separate payment, it won't be until you have the SAR that they will show

Your friend is a liar.
PPI payments are never hidden, it's a claims company myth.

A SAR is a request for information, not an exhaustive history of your credit with a company.
The FSA recommends destroying data after a recommended 6 years or when no longer needed, 2007 is more than 6 years ago.
The';re actually getting better at destroying the data since the PPI debacle. They also don't have to show you destruction documents, that part should be omitted.

hotlioness

Ok. So on the transactions with Danske there were PPI payments showing that amounted to £86, that was all I could find, but numerous loans for my business that were often paid back within the month, as loaned for big items due to sell to a customer then when the item was sold the loan was paid... but when I asked for the PPI's to be refunded, they offered £924. I just don't understand. Were there PPI payments missing or did that one £86 accumulate over the years?

antrobus

hotlioness wrote: »

.. All I want is A SAR... .

A subject access request is something you make, not something you get. The ICO advises that any SAR should contain "details of the specific information you require"; so what information did you request?

http://ico.org.uk/for_the_public/personal_information

[Deleted User]

hotlioness wrote: »

They are also stating there is no PPI on the mortgage but they cannot show a printout to prove it

Why would the Bank have to prove that there was no PPI? It's not criminal to have insurance and if their records show no PPI then you have to accept that unless you (as the complainant) have evidence to the contrary.

A Claims Company cannot help you obtain information that the Bank don't have.


Have you actually sent these Banks a Subject Access Request (SAR) letter? In it, you request the information you require and (if it is available) the Bank are obliged to send it to you. Here is a SAR template letter;
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/1475553

hotlioness

Yes I sent the letters that I copied from this site. I just assumed there would be more information in a SAR, not just transactions. I didn't understand the abbreviations (PPP)? I thought you would clearly see where documents had been destroyed or copies of any signed documents

dunstonh

I just assumed there would be more information in a SAR, not just transactions. I didn't understand the abbreviations (PPP)?

A SAR will not yield consumer facing documents. Codes do not need to be explained or converted. it is literally a copy of what they have.

I thought you would clearly see where documents had been destroyed or copies of any signed documents

No audit trail of destruction is needed or required. Copies of signed documentation would be supplied if it was maintained in a relevant filing system. However, documentation may lose its link to records over time and cease to be in a relevant filing system.