Why can't I discuss the weekly poll?

edited 30 November -1 at 1:00AM in Site Feedback
5 replies 769 views
dancingfairydancingfairy Forumite
9.1K Posts
edited 30 November -1 at 1:00AM in Site Feedback
Anyone else having this problem? I'm logged in, I voted in the weekly poll (on paying the minimum wage) but apparently I don't have enough privilidges to discuss the results of the poll :(
Making my money go further with MSE :j
How much can I save in 2012 challenge
75/1200 :eek:


  • Torry_QuineTorry_Quine Forumite
    18.6K Posts
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Bake Off Boss!
    Same problem for me.
    Lost my soulmate so life is empty.

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  • torbrextorbrex
    71.3K Posts
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker Rampant Recycler Hung up my suit!
    It's probably because the discussion thread has not actually been started yet.
  • Li0nheadLi0nhead Forumite
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    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    You can only access it if on more than 14.66p/h. :)
    Hi there! We’ve had to remove your signature. It was so good we removed it because we cannot think of one so good as you had and need to protect others from seeing such a great signature.
  • edited 19 May 2014 at 10:43PM
    TurnUpForTheBooks_2TurnUpForTheBooks_2 Forumite
    436 Posts
    edited 19 May 2014 at 10:43PM
    Same here - so let's start the discussion anyway !

    The UK minimum wage, increasingly poor working conditions, deliberate government ploy to make it harder to bring cases against employers plus the widespread use of zero hours contracts have all created a stupid dumbed down fearful disrespected labour market in the UK which means we are now like third world savages compared to some other so called western countries.

    So called strivers are expected to eat dirt and get up and ask for more whilst success is measured according to the cloth of City fraudsters running banks and insurance companies or legal firms (they're all in it together of course - but we're not).

    Our unions are not worth a light any more - the last union leader worth a light was lost a few months ago. He was a bit too "darn to bleedin' urf" for most, but his heart was in the right place.

    There are better developed Northern European countries than ours where they still attract Eastern European labour and economic immigrants (probably including me shortly). They still have respected trades unions. Everyone respects you no matter what your job, even if you empty bins to make ends meet. That is a clear difference to the UK where most citizens look down on bin men and other low paid workers.

    Another clear difference is that the lowest paid workers elsewhere are rarely seen holding their head high, usually seen in their own worn out day clothes that are spoiled at work - painters in jeans covered in paint sitting on the tube in the rush hour. In Northern Europe high quality protective uniforms for the working man are often de rigueur, and arrangements are automatic to ensure they are laundered and maintain a business-like image. In the UK we us a different and very much brader catch-all phrase "workman-like" and it does not mean business-like, does it?

    All commercial vehicles in some countries have conspicuous official marks identifying the owner by number so very few anonymous white vans - very few anonymous throwaway workers, very little evidence of could care less quality workmanship.

    And amazingly you may find that these working citizens who often receive a good living wage without there being a national minimum, are proud to pay quite high levels of tax. Because their government and systems work better than ours and citizens value what their taxes pay for.

    If I told you that a typical undergraduate working as a part-time shelf stacker in the Northern European equivalent of Tesco was paid twice what Tesco might pay the same kind of student in the UK, would you laugh or cry?

    If I told you that typical North Europeans live in dwellings 50% greater in floor area than UK workers accept as the norm, but typical pay average housing costs no greater than ours would you laugh or cry?

    We have it wrong in the UK - after Thatcher destroyed the unions and then led us towards Big Bang in financial services, the die was cast. It has gone terribly wrong now. If you are a worker in a big supermarket or fast food chain you deserve to be respected at least a twelfth as much as a top CEO for what you do ! That is typically the way wealth is distributed much more fairly in some countries - the CEO will earn maybe 12x what you do or 20x at a push - not the stupid multiples and lottery numbers we see in UK and USA.

    And when you are not working and enjoying leisure time, then you might find you are rubbing shoulders with all up to CEO types, and it is the most natural thing.

    In many parts of the world McDonalds workers are protesting at pay levels and working conditions. It doesn't have to be that way. For years there has been frequent reference to a semi-official BigMac chart of the cost of living around the world. The price of a BigMac gives you an indication of the cost of living in that country.

    That is a fallacy. In my experience the price of a BigMac is more a direct indication of the general quality of living in a country not the relative cost of it, even in big experimental economies like China's. At least there experiments are based on making stuff. Maybe one of the biggest experimental economies is ours - it's so much hot air!

    In some Northern European countries you won't find McDonalds workers complaining too much in 2014. Because they are paid well enough, and can afford to live solid lives without fear of job-loss or poverty, are respected by their employers and neighbours alike, and basically are happy right now. They are not molli-coddled by strict employment legislation that makes them hard to fire as in France. They are simply a confident workforce in a buoyant market who if made jobless can find and do tend to find another job quite fast and if not will receive substantial and respectful state welfare help until they do get another job. They will not all be forced to accept zero hours contracts at six or seven quid an hour making sandwiches if they've signed on for 3 months running.

    We could achieve so much more if we travelled a bit and came back and did something with what we learned about how progressive societies work.

    I have described what some will laugh at and call some imagined Utopia, and I would be the first to admit that it may not last, but in the UK we can do so much better if we root out the worst excesses of the corporates and start respecting labour again of every type.
    From the late great Tommy Cooper: "He said 'I'm going to chop off the bottom of one of your trouser legs and put it in a library.' I thought 'That's a turn-up for the books.' "
  • Hi all

    Just to let you know I've made the poll discussion live so feel free to head over there to discuss the issue.

    *** Get the Martin's Money Tips Free E-mail at www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips ***
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