Service charges, maintenance

Tom_B_

Hi

The building I'm in needed the intercom system replaced last April (2013). I refused to pay any more service charges until it was fixed in August (they hadn't even looked at it).

This April, a year after it was broken and the main door didn't lock, it was fixed.

I now have a bill for the service charges going back to August as well as £300 for work on the door.

The service charge statement says the service charges are for "building maintenance and repair"... surely the intercom system and front door is exactly that?

What really annoys me is that the management company added 12.5% + VAT to the total cost of the works as a "management fee". If nothing else, surely the service charges should cover that!

My questions are:

1) Do I have to pay the 6 months worth of service charges going back when the management company did nothing at all for a whole year (I paid them while the door was broken for 6 months and every time I called they were sending someone out "next week" which is why I stopped paying.). They weren't doing their job, do I really have to pay them for sitting on their !!!! for a year?

2) I don't mind paying for the work to be carried out as I wanted it fixed, but the 12.5%+VAT they're charging on top seems very wrong! Is there anything I can argue against the 12.5%?

Thanks.

G_M

1) Yes

2) No

dancingfairy

You have entered into a contract, you can't just stop paying them. There must be proper complaints procedures in place. What steps have you taken to resolve the issue?
Have you written to them and kept a copy?
Have you followed their complaints procedure?
Have you joined up with other owners/occupiers?
Have you taken advice?
Have you escalated your complaint as far as you can with the organisation?
What options did they give you? I would have thought they would give you details of an independent ombudsman or similar if you have been through their complaints procedure and are still at a deadlock stage.
df

Ulfar

Was the repair split between all the residents or not, was it in accordance with the lease ? If it was then fair enough if not then I would challenge it.

I am assuming the intercom is for the whole block and not just your flat.

Mokka

Intercom is an amenity for which you wee paying, if it was not provided you can deduct money from the service charge. Not sure how though.
Have you tried Leasehold Advisory Service? If not google them.

G_M

Mokka wrote: »

Intercom is an amenity for which you wee paying, if it was not provided you can deduct money from the service charge. .

Do you say this because it seems to you to be a fair thing to do, or because you know this to be legally the case......?

Edit. Oops!

OP - don't worry. Just deduct what you want. It will all be OK. You have my heart-felt sympathy for having to manage without an intercom.

Tom_B_

Thanks for your replies.

I understand that I need to pay the service charge but from my point of view the management company did nothing to upheld their end of the contract which says the service charge is for "repair/maintenance and cleaning of the common areas". From April to August I paid service charges for this purpose yet the building was not being maintained or repaired. Although they've done it after a year doesn't excuse the fact that it took that whole year to get anything done and I don't see why they deserve to get paid for the time they weren't upholding their end of the contract.

It wasn't just the intercom which wasn't working, the lock on the main door was broken as it was connected, which was a security issue.

ging84

the problem is you probably don't have a contract with the management company
you most likely just have a lease with the freeholder in which you agree to meet all the freeholder's costs
the freeholder is the one with the contract with the management company, the freeholder might or might not be within his rights to turn around and say i'm not paying the whole bill because... but there is no incentive for him to do so, because it's your money he's spending not his own.
And unless the management agent feels there is a realistic threat of the leaseholders exercising their right to manage powers to get rid of them, they've got no incentive to reduce anything on the bill

Mokka

In my opinion (I am not a lawyer and new to the whole leasehold business) you should pay the service charge for now but then challenge it and ask for it to be paid back.
At the moment you are in breach of your lease and even if you start legal action this will seriously count against you.

You can ask for the breakdown of what the service charges are for. They must be proven to be reasonable. Read more here:

http://www.lease-advice.org/publications/documents/document.asp?item=14#9

Re: GMs question where I got the idea about deducting money for amenity which was not provided the honest answer is I don't remember- I read about it somewhere and it stuck in my mind.

chris_aaaaa

You have to pay and then challenge, you are then in control of proceedings and legals fees are bit more controlled (since it all changed to FTT not sure how much control you get now).


The alternative is the manager gets to start proceedings in preparation to forfeiture, which in some leases means legal fees are unrestrained, when it gets passed to the FTT it is on limited grounds.


Have a google of things like leasehold hell, carlex etc and you will see how bad it can get.

propertyman

In most leases SC is an estimated amount which they think that they will spend over the year and your payment in full allows them to do that. if you or others don't pay then they don't have the funds to pay the contractors hence the delays and lack of service.

At the end of the year either the lease or a statutory right requires the freeholder to account for what they actually spend, and you can see the invoices, and in turn adjust the estimated payment versus the actual cost. The exact mechanics depends on your lease.


if they budgeted for 52 weeks cleaning and only carried out 35 due to lack of funds then that is what you should be charged.

This also includes the 12.5% management fee as some leases allow for the landlords costs of management, which is part of the service charge, to be on a % not a fixed fee per flat basis.

If the cleaning door repair etc were done poorly and the cost does not represent the service that you receive then you can complain and ultimately ask the FTT to determine what a fair amount is.

The biggest mistake that most flat owners do is ignore the contract that they have the lease which as above often sets out payments in advance, and superimpose "if I am not happy I don't pay" and therefore tie the hands of the landlord or agent by not giving them the money that they need to instruct contractors. You might think that is odd but that is how most leases work like it or not.:)


if you and others pay you are in a better situation to berate tthe landlord to get their finger out.:money: