UKPC Ticket for leaving car park in Bury last week

Kent1976

I am new to the forum therefore apologise in advance for asking questions or information which may already have been mentioned. My wife parked in the car park and left the site to visit Bar Doc for a medical emergency. The car park belonging to Bar Doc was full. On her return which was within 2 hours she found the ticket on the windscreen. I am the registered keeper and owner of the vehicle.
Despite reading through this forum i am a little confused. Should write to them or wait for them to send something through the post? And if i wait would i not go past the 14 day period. Also if do reply to them now would this letter suffice:-

Dear UKPC,

I’m in receipt of your parking invoice dated XXXX and acknowledge that I was the registered keeper on the date of the alleged infringement although not the driver. I wish to invoke your appeals process as all liability to your company is denied on the following grounds:

1. There is no fee payable at Moorgate Retail park so therefore the amount being claimed is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss.

2. Your signage does not comply with the BPA code of practice, 2012 Version 2 Appendix B.

3. You are not the landowner and do not have the capacity to offer contracts or to bring a claim for trespass.

These points and numerous others will be raised with POPLA should you not accept this appeal, and you will also be expected to provide a full breakdown of your alleged loss, and your full unredacted contract with the landowner.

If you do reject the challenge and insist on taking the matter further I must inform you at this stage that I may claim expenses from you that are not exhaustive but may include the cost of stamps, envelopes, travel expenses, legal fees etc.

Please reply to this challenge within 14 days of receipt as per BPA code of practice part 22.8.

Please issue your cancellation or forward a POPLA appeal form AND a POPLA verification code within 35 days of receipt of this letter.

Any communication that does not either confirm cancellation or include a POPLA verification code shall be reported to the BPA as a breach of their code of practice section 22.12. The BPA recently issued guidance to all members to remind them of this fact.

Yours Fathfully

Also should i put my address on top? Is this reply right? Please kindly advise accordingly as i have sea of information but cannot decide how to approach this.

Thanks in advance

Redx

chances are they ticketed the vehicle because the driver left the site

plenty of similar threads on here over the same issues , so have a read of those by using the search word BURY

wait for the NTK then appeal as you have pasted above (or similar wording) , same as all the other similar threads have done

everything you need to know is in the NEWBIES sticky thread at the top of this forum

Kent1976

Thank you Redx but my question is that if i leave it for them to send me a letter in post would i then not be outside of the 14 day period for a reduced penalty? In other words if i waited and was declined would i then have to pay the £100 fine instead of the £60 reduced one

Redx

I would never answer that question on here because to me its academic , due to the fact that once your popla appeal goes in they will cancel, or popla will cancel it on their behalf (seen it enough times before as far as bury is concerned , never mind other sites)

you appeal, they cancel or issue a popla code , you win at popla (or they cancel) - nil cost - end of story

that is my take on this so I dont do the what-ifs - sorry

ie:- if you are here to save money , you take it all the way and save all of your money, no half measures

edit - read post #2 here https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4957221

Dublindel

Inside the time or outside. Get the POPLA code, mention pre estimate of loss, game over.

fisherjim

For a start you are in the wrong mindset you have used the words fine, and penalty you have a scam invoice.

The discount they are "offering" is part of the con on two counts:
1 To dress the scam up as a legitimate charge.
2 To scare you into rushing into paying.

Don't fall for it follow the advice on here and you will pay nothing and cost these con men into the bargain.

UKPC are toothless lowlife scum and can easily be beaten, they are bullies that only issue threats.
This leaving site scam is one of their favourite little earners for their bonus hungry illiterate attendants!

Kent1976

Point taken guys and i will wait for the letter before appealing. is the draft letter in my first post okay for the first soft appeal when i recieve a written letter from them?

Also please note i am new to all this and to be honest was going to make the payment when i came across this God sent forum. I feel cheated and bullied

Redx

the template letter in the newbies thread is fine to appeal it , so if yours is similar then no problem , but do not admit to driving or imply who the driver is (or was)

yes you are being cheated and bullied, so dont get mad , get even , and cost them money at popla too

Kent1976

I am really bad at finding information and still haven't found templates for a first letter and also for popla appeal. Please very kindly provide me with links.

Coupon-mad

It's one click back to page one - see my signature below all my posts, to see where to click to see current threads!

Please start again at square one and don't pass 'go' until you've read the 'PRIVATE PARKING TICKET? NEWBIES PLEASE READ THIS FIRST!' thread at the top and learn how/when to appeal (the registered keeper appeals). We have 100% record of winning appeals at POPLA stage, for over a year now.

Welcome to the parking forum!

Kent1976

Hello all. I have now recieved the NTK in post and have drafted this reply from the sections you asked me to look at. Please kindly let me know this is good before i send it of.

Dear UKPC,

PCN number xxxxxxxxxxxxx

As the registered keeper, I have received your parking invoice which of course, I decline your invitation to pay. I wish to invoke your appeals process, since all liability to your company is denied on the following basis:

1) The amount being claimed is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss to your company or the
landowner
2) Your signage does not comply with your ATA Code of Practice and was not sufficiently
prominent to create any contract
3) You are not the landowner and do not have the standing to offer contracts nor to bring a
claim for trespass

Please issue your standard cancellation letter or a specific, detailed rejection letter. If you choose to send the latter, it must state:

- the legal basis of your charge (i.e. breach, trespass or contractual fee?) as your signage was
not seen/accepted by the driver and your recent Notice failed to make the basis of the charge
clear. As keeper, I cannot be expected to guess the nature of the allegation.

- if alleging breach of contract, with your rejection letter I require a breakdown of the
liquidated damages suffered, and by whom, and when this calculation was determined and
how this particular 'loss' arose. Please also explain how/why you charge a fixed sum no
matter whether the alleged contravention was trivial or more serious and how that can
amount to a genuine pre-estimate of loss.

- if alleging trespass please enclose evidence of the perpetrator and proof of the liquidated
damages alleged and the calculation of this sum.

- if alleging 'contractual fee' I require that you now send me a VAT invoice by return and
explain the daily rate for parking and service provided for the fee. Failure to provide this
information and a VAT invoice now that I have requested it, will be considered evidence
that this was not in fact a genuine offer to park for a fee and is merely a penalty which is not
recoverable in contract law (as found by Mr Recorder Gibson QC, on appeal at Luton
County Court in the case of Civil Enforcement v McCafferty 3YK50188 (AP476)
21/2/2014).

Take formal note:

(a) Your unsupported, unsolicited invoice and any further letters if you persist, will constitute
harassment. If you continue, your contact and that of any agent will be deemed a 'serious
and persistent unwarranted threat' as found by Lord Justice Sedley in Ferguson v British
Gas Trading Ltd [2009] EWCA Civ 46 (10 February 2009) and I reserve the right to take
the matter further. You have been informed that I consider this to be harassment so any
decision to send further letters rather than cancel the invoice will reinforce the evidence
of your persistent unwarranted threat and you may be required to justify your actions in
court.

(b) Any obfuscation on your part, such as pretending I have to name the driver, alleging I am
too late or unable to appeal as keeper or requiring more evidence when clearly I have
already set out my full challenge for this stage, will be reported to the DVLA and to your
respective ATA, as a sanctionable breach of your Code of Practice.

(c) If you reject my challenge and insist upon taking the matter further I must inform you that
I may claim my costs from you and my time at the court rate of £18 per hour. The
expenses I may claim are not exhaustive but may include the cost of stamps, envelopes,
travel expenses and legal fees as well as liquidated damages for distress arising from
harassment.

By continuing to pursue me you hereby accept liability to pay my costs when I prevail and you acknowledge and imply full understanding of the above.

Regards,