Wing Parking & Debt Recovery Plus Ltd

Coupon-mad

HO87 wrote: »

@Aussie_Londoner - Bear in mind that this may not be the only appeal that you have to make. Wing operate a non-standard appeal system with the LB/arm's length companies they work for. It is entirely possible that you will have to make 3 appeals at least one being through Citywest Homes (which I'm guessing will apply in your case) before you get a POPLA code.

Good point HO87. The OP should appeal through all stages to get there in the end.

Aussie_Londoner

@HO87 - Thanks for the tip. Would that mean simply sending the appeal letter again & again or drafting a new appeal argument each time? (I will post once I get a response from the PPC

HO87

The only appeal that counts is the one that goes to POPLA. Just repeat it until you get that code.

Aussie_Londoner

So today Wing wrote back acknowledging my appeal and referring me to CityWest homes for a secondary appeal.

Given what you have said @HO87, do I just copy the PPC letter to the landowner as this is the 2nd appeal?

I'm not quite sure due to the references to "you are not the landowner" in point 3. Do I just take this out and appear asking that this was a builder/contractor doing repairs on my flat, and if they could waive the penalty?

Coupon-mad

It's not a penalty, but TBH it's the builder who needs to do these appeals. You are a third party to all this if it's not your vehicle. You should liaise with the builder and if need be you could write the appeals in his name if you really want to help him out, as you know the situation and how to win at POPLA (which again has to be in his name). You could send whatever you like to the next stage of appeal - perhaps you could write your own letter to corroborate 'his' story but I stress the appeal has to come from the driver or keeper of the vehicle or POPLA will simply throw it out later on and all the best laid plans could come crashing down.

We always beat Wing at POPLA though - so as long as he gets the code he's laughing.

HO87

Further to the above I believe that there will be a further appeal - back to Wing - after the CityWest Homes one. Adjust the appeal to suit the audience and just keep ploughing that furrow. Obviously better that the appeal comes from the builder - though there is no reason why you shouldn't be giving him a hand to draft it.

Once we're at POPLA, As C_M has stated, we can beat them.

Aussie_Londoner

Thanks both @C_M and @HO87 - and don't worry it's all in the builder's name, I'm just drafting all the letters on their behalf and asking the builder to send the letters.

So, the next (2nd) appeal to CityWest Homes should be asking for a reprieve? Perhaps as @C_M mentioned, I could sent CWH a letter as the owner of the property to corroborate his appeal. Guess it won't hurt.

Any good templates or content for the CWH appeal?

Coupon-mad

No, it could be written in a more 'normal' way I would suggest because they are not the PPC and will be 'normal' office people considering any mitigation (the exact opposite of what you'll hit them with at POPLA stage!). And definitely include corroboration from yourself, giving date/vehicle details and info about the business being undertaken and asking how on earth residents are supposed to get contractors to visit if builders are given such a hard time for being anywhere near the building when obviously they have to unload heavy tools & other unwieldy items!

Aussie_Londoner

Hi guys

So we received a letter from CWH to say the window for appealing has now passed and we should now appeal to POPLA. They gave us a POPLA code and form to complete. I understand this is where we want to be!

Now then, in drafting the letter to POPLA with my appeal points, I plan to go with the following:

1. The Charge is not a genuine pre-estimate of the loss.

2. Wing Parking has NOT specifically demonstrated a proprietary interest in the land, because they have no legal possession, therefore they have no legal basis to allege breach of contract or trespass and the loss arising from the breach. I should also add that when Wing responded to our first appeal, they said... We confirm that the contract to park is not actually offered by ourselves at all, it is offered by our clients, who do hold the necessary legal interest in the property. We are not offering the contract, we are merely acting as agents in the management of that contract. We have a written and signed agreement with City of Westminster where they authorise us to carry out this service for them. . With that should I bluff and ask Wing to provide POPLA with this contract? And will they call the bluff?

3. Contend that Wing are only an agent working for the owner and their signs do not help them to form a contract without any consideration capable of being offered

4. Even if a basic contract is produced and mentions PCNs, the lack of ownership or assignment of title or interest in the land reduces any contract to one that exists simply on an agency basis between Wing and the owner/occupier, containing nothing that Wing can lawfully use in their own name as a mere agent, that could impact on a third party customer.

Is there anything else worth including? I have read all the forums, and I have condensed it down to these points. Just checking that it's strong enough to pass the appeal and have the POPLA adjudicator dismiss the charge.

Appreciate all your help once again.

da_rule

You seem to have it covered. Obviously each point needs to be expanded on.

Once you have an expanded version post it up and you'll no doubt receive some feedback.