Your thoughts on university

Person_one

claire21 wrote: »

Person_one I understand where you are coming from but they have to be able to support themselves financially somehow.

An education is never going to be a hindrance to that though.

notanewuser

Valli wrote: »

I don't think so. I could quite accept that one could pass a GCSE with POOR literacy skills. I doubt one could pass ANY GCSE if one were illiterate.

An illiterate person cannot read and write his or her own name...so that's the first hurdle failed!

The ones that can write their names get a C minimum.

Person_one

Janepig wrote: »

To be honest it's probably why most of our receptionists over the last few years have been atrocious (apart from the last two who now have admin jobs with us) - I think one of them even had a masters. The current two are worse than useless. Back in the day it was a job you didn't need a heap of qualifications for, so you weren't sitting there thinking you were too good to be there, but it was often a springboard into bigger and better things in the organisation. I did many a stint on reception years ago and it gives you a good grounding in the sort of people we work with.

The two we have on there now can't even get people's names right when they phone through to let you know they're there, and often forget about people and leave them waiting for ages before they let the person they've come to see know they are there (not a good idea with the type of people we work with!). In a way I can't blame them but it certainly seems to be the case that with many degrees you still have to do your stint at the bottom and work up - and that experience can be invaluable!

Jx

Sounds like your company might need better inductions/training for its receptionists!

Bennifred

Valli wrote: »

I don't think so. I could quite accept that one could pass a GCSE with POOR literacy skills. I doubt one could pass ANY GCSE if one were illiterate.

An illiterate person cannot read and write his or her own name...so that's the first hurdle failed!

Indeed - those poor kids don't even get entered for GCSEs.

daisiegg

Buzzybee90 wrote: »

If I wanted to spend 27k on something just for the love of it, I'd buy a land rover.

But you are not 'spending' £27k. You are basically signing up to pay a small tax when you are earning over a certain amount, after you graduate. Many will never even pay it off. I know I won't. I currently work part time and only pay back a tiny amount a month. I am giving up work later this year to have a family and won't go back for a number of years; when I do, it will probably only ever be on a low part time contract and I will never pay my loan off. It has absolutely no impact on my life; it does not count in your credit score, doesn't have to be declared on mortgage applications, etc. I have friends who have not even started paying their loans back five years after graduating as they do more study or travel or 'work to live' in lower paying non career jobs that just enable them to earn enough to have a fun life and do lots of travelling. Some of them may eventually get higher paying jobs and pay back some or all of their loan but lots of them probably never will, like me. Certainly none of us would go back and not go to university because of the 'debt' we now have!

zagubov

Person_one wrote: »

I think it's a real shame that so many people now view university and education in general as just a means to an end. As though all that matters is whether it leads to a 'good' job. Personally, I think education is worthwhile for both the individual and wider society even if it never earns you a penny.

I think I blame tuition fees for that, so many parents now view a degree as an investment like any other, they want a measurable return for that outlay. Plenty of people through history have been well educated and made a huge contribution to society without ever being particularly successful financially.

You're spot-on! I think the whole current system's terrible.
I think everybody who could benefit from it should get further or higher education. I believe education's both a basic right and also an emergency service and just as we need to extinguish disease, injury, crime, fires, etc. we also need to extinguish ignorance.

I'm not sure that full- time attendance of a degree course is the way to do it. Danny Baker said "There is no honour to be had in not knowing a thing that can be known" and I agree with that. People should take advantage of more courses online. I'd suggest evening courses but they're under threat in our budget-constrained times.

If people feel they are paying for a degree, no wonder they have to link it to employability. In the past it was OK to do a first degree in something you were interested in. You could do a Master's to convert your knowledge into something that would help you get somewhere.

Now where would you get the money for that? You'd need to get a professional development loan, or you'd try to make your first degree the one that makes you employable.

A side-effect is that now many people have to do a Masters degree to stand out, and that can lead to even more debt. There's a kind of a qualifications arms race going on. It's gradually becoming the new Honours degree (as was).

I remember back in the 70s people did ordinary Bachelor's degrees or Honours ones and maybe go for a doctorate. Within ten years ordinary degrees were rare, Honours degrees wwere the new entry-level qualification and loads of people were doing Masters degrees. Back then half the people doing doctorates had done Masters degrees first, now it's even more common. We're witnesseing a kind of "academic inflation".

I've a relative in the US who has by now earned three US degrees
-an Associate's degree which is somewhere between our HND and the old dipHE that's really rare now,
-an honours Bachelors degree which is like our old ordinary/pass Bachelors degree that's also really rare now
-and a Masters degree which is like our Honours degree.

We're getting so close to the US model of HE I think we're moving towards that situation. The Foundation degrees that are coming in are no bad things but I think they only cover levels of study we would previously have regarded as Diploma level.

Soon the questions we'll be asking isn't whether to do a degree but how many to do. :eek:

whodathunkit

claire21 wrote: »

This thread has been quite a wakeup call to me, I had no idea people with a degree end up working in a call centre, I find that quite depressing.

I'm definitely going to take a lot more interest in what happens at school, it's quite had with a 6ft 14 year old boy who grunts quite a bit to get much out of him but I know he's very happy at school.

It seems very unusual for a parent to find the money to send two children to private school and then not take much interest in what they do there!

CreditCrunchie

My thoughts are that it is only useful to have a degree if it is a STEM area (where jobs are plentiful), marine biology (random I know, but graduates are snapped up), or when an employer is paying for you to train as a pre-requisite to a job. Also if you have the spare cash to undertake a degree purely for pleasure.

For anyone else, aside from the feel good factor, it's a non-starter.

I have not used my degree (completed 10 years ago), and can only remember once being asked about it. I've worked in high level corporate positions, management, and now run my own business. I'd have been running my own business a lot sooner if I hadn't bothered wasting 3 years at university. I'd also not be still in debt over it! Yes I'm bitter - not because I got a crappy degree (I got a 1st) or because it was in a useless area/ bad university (it wasn't!), but because I honestly believe it WOULD lead me to a job and a higher pay packet. Instead I spent nearly 3 years bar tending and doing promotional modelling before scoring that first decent job. That job didn't even require a degree! Luckily I got in on personality and self confidence (sales & advertising), and then worked my way up in the company. I made a load of money, but also watched my much younger colleagues progress up the ladder much faster as they'd been working there since leaving school instead of wasting 3 years out of the work force.

The government seems to be on an inexplicable drive to get more and more young people into debt. THey perpetuate the myth that a degree equals a job and better pay - it most certainly doesn't!

Practical, hands on course like NVQ's, and on-job training are the way forward.

whodathunkit

CreditCrunchie wrote: »

My thoughts are that it is only useful to have a degree if it is a STEM area (where jobs are plentiful), marine biology (random I know, but graduates are snapped up), or when an employer is paying for you to train as a pre-requisite to a job. Also if you have the spare cash to undertake a degree purely for pleasure.

For anyone else, aside from the feel good factor, it's a non-starter.

I have not used my degree (completed 10 years ago), and can only remember once being asked about it. I've worked in high level corporate positions, management, and now run my own business. I'd have been running my own business a lot sooner if I hadn't bothered wasting 3 years at university. I'd also not be still in debt over it!

The government seems to be on an inexplicable drive to get more and more young people into debt. THey perpetuate the myth that a degree equals a job and better pay - it most certainly doesn't!

Practical, hands on course like NVQ's, and on-job training are the way forward.

The introduction of NVQs (Not Very Qualified) has led to the destruction of much practical and trade training in this country and the inability of many young people to achieve recognised training and qualifications in useful areas such as construction.

CreditCrunchie

daisiegg wrote: »

Many will never even pay it off. I know I won't. I currently work part time and only pay back a tiny amount a month. I am giving up work later this year to have a family and won't go back for a number of years; when I do, it will probably only ever be on a low part time contract and I will never pay my loan off.

Read this thread https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4923210
Those of us on the income dependent loans (Post 2000) have this coming to us in the next couple of years as the government sells of the rest of its student loans book. So yes you most certainly WILL pay it off, and may even end up with a bad credit record over it!