PCN Morrisons wood green 03/01/2014

Jessica_fleet

Hi

I have been through the newbie thread but have pretty bad dyslexia so have been struggling to figure out what I need to do so help would be greatly recieved.

I am a student in Hertfordshire but my car and postal adress remain in shropshire at my families home, over new year i visited friends in london and picked up a pcn via post from the orrisons car park in wood green. I have only just been home and opened my mail by which point i am way past deadlines and have already had 2 debt recovery letters.
Date= 03/01/2014
Time in Carpark=3hrs
Maximum stay is 2hr (its a free carpark)

I have not contacted parking eye yet and wished to check on here what to say before i do. From what ive read i need to issue an appeal to them, but on what grounds? i read you can get them on the grounds of the following:
1) The amount being claimed is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss to your company or the landowner
2) Your signage does not comply with your ATA Code of Practice and was not sufficiently prominent to create any contract
3) You are not the landowner and do not have the standing to offer contracts nor to bring a claim for trespass
So do i just send the appeal letter from the sticky thread or do i need to send them something about why im soo late requesting an appeal... or do i wait for them to tell me im too late to appeal and then send them the letter re. i can appeal at anytime according to POPLA.


Many thanks for any help. Seriously worried as its now been 3 months and im sure a court summons is imminent!

Redx

send P.E. the template letter ASAP in the NEWBIES thread, online and in writing if necessary (with free certificate of posting at the post office) - ie:- not recorded delivery

yes they will probably reject it , but you should still do it asap , before any court papers arrive

come back when you have had a reply

ps:- also complain to Morrissons CEO direct as well , check the NEWBIES thread for contact details, or try and get the local shop manager to cancel this charge asap , or both

Jessica_fleet

Ok i have just had this email back after sending parking eye the template letter off the newbie page.......

Thank you for your online enquiry sent to our client regarding the above Parking Charge Notice (PCN).
As the account was not settled at first instance, the matter has now been passed on to us at the debt recovery stage and therefore all future correspondence should be directed to our company.
As per the British Parking Association’s (BPA) Code of Practice, Point 22.7, the driver/keeper/hirer was allowed 28 days from the date the PCN was issued to challenge the PCN. The time to challenge the charge has now expired and therefore access to the Independent Appeals Service (POPLA) is no longer available.
However, in order to resolve this matter, I will offer the following comments as to why this PCN was correctly issued and is still payable.

My findings
The site in question is subject to terms and conditions, which are stated on signs throughout the area. The signage on site is sufficient and is in line with the guidelines laid down by the British Parking Association (BPA). As these terms were breached on 3rd January 2014, a PCN was correctly and legitimately issued.
The terms were breached because the vehicle was parked for longer than the time allowed on the site.

Amount charged
Regarding the amount charged, if you refer to the British Parking Association’s code of practice, you will discover that the sum in question is within what this body deems reasonable.
The outstanding Parking Charge amount has been calculated as a genuine pre-estimate of loss as our client incurs significant costs in managing this car park to ensure motorists comply with the stated terms and conditions and to follow up any breaches of these. These costs are made up of;
· DVLA and associated fees for obtaining keeper details.
Clerical costs there arising, including stationery and postage.
Legal and other professional advice; wages and salaries of staff involved in that, together with National Insurance and other similar related sums.
Loss of potential parking fee (where one is payable).
Loss of revenue (if it is a retail outlet).
This is not a detailed estimate for this particular case but rather an estimate of the potential loss.
This sum, and the calculations which have been made in setting it, has been approved and agreed by the landowner (or the landowner’s agent). The amount charged was also clearly laid out on the signage at the site, and by remaining on site, we contend that the motorist has accepted all of the prevailing terms and conditions of that contract, including the charges for breach of contract.
The amount charged is in line with the parking charges accepted by the courts as being legally permissible to claim. See Parking Eye Ltd v Somerfield Stores [2011], Combined Parking Solutions Ltd v Dorrington [2012], Napier Parking Ltd v Mr Darren Yau [2012] and Parking Eye Ltd v Kevin Shelley [2013].
Furthermore, as the charge was not settled with the parking company and the case was consequently passed to a debt recovery company for collection, further costs were incurred on a similar basis.

Harassment
Within the correspondence harassment has also been referred to and therefore I feel obliged to point out that under S1(3)(c) of The Harassment Act 1997, a course of conduct that someone alleges to be harassment will not be deemed so if the person who pursued it shows that in the particular circumstances the pursuit of the course of conduct was reasonable.
Under the circumstances our course of action has been entirely reasonable and in no way reaches the high threshold of harassment. Our company has legitimately pursued recompense for a breach of the terms and conditions attached to our client’s site.

You invoice claim
I write to confirm this firm does not accept or wish to enter into any form of contract nor do we accept your charges of £18.00 per hour. I would also draw your attention to the following case where such a claim was rejected in court: I CANT PUT LINK ON HERE

Internet templates
I must also stress that simply sending in standard template responses, most likely obtained from the internet, will not resolve the matter. In addition, I would recommend that professional legal advice be sought on this matter as an alternative.
What you need to do now

Please pay £135.00 by 9th May 2014. You can pay online or by phone 0844 561 0965. You can find full details of how to pay on the reverse of the letter(s) sent to you.

What will happen if you do not pay what you owe
If you do not pay the amount by the date shown above, I will pass your case to our legal team, who will consider taking legal action to recover what is due.

What if you do not agree
Although any correspondence that does not provide further evidence will be noted and retained, I cannot guarantee that we will reply to it.

More information
This parking charge has been issued under the terms of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. To comply with that act, we may need to write to you at specified times until the account is settled.

Kind Regards



Ian Grantham
Collections Manager
Debt Recovery Plus Ltd
P.O. Box 411
Dukinfield
SK14 9DD


ANY HELP IS APPRECIATED ON WHAT TO DO NEXT THANKS

Coupon-mad

Try searching this forum for the keyword 'my findings' to read all the other threads where people got the same drivel and laughed at it.

And did I email you the other day? It's kind of obvious what to do to reset the clock.

Jessica_fleet

Thanks coupon mad yes i saw it today. Ideally i want to get out of paying it all together still keeping myself as the driver and am trying to keep the option of resetting the clock and using another driver as the last resort because if i do that il probably end up paying it at the reduced cost.

I just want to know what to do about this email... do i reply... what do i reply with... do i ignore it... are there cases that get dropped/ followed up?

Also more importantly.... The letter says it is too late to appeal to popla is this correct?

Thanks

Stroma

Don't lie for this, if you are the driver and the RK of the vehicle then you have to deal with this yourself. The drivel that they send out is just a template of complete rubbish. It's never too late for popla as even when a small claim is issued you can ask the court to refer to popla.

I suggest that you make complaints to Morrisons on this, say you are a customer and don't expect to be harassed for shopping at their store, the extra time was used to spend extra money at their shop. Show some receipts if you have any, or redacted bank statements to show spend.

And if you do have receipts of that time in the shop copy them on to parking eye as you are a genuine shopper and have proof of that.

Jessica_fleet

That letter gives me less than 1 week to pay though how do i tackle that? Should i email them back and tell them they are incorrect re. it being too late to appeal to popla?

I have just been through my online bank account, i have payments to morrisons but for the weeks before and after, none near that date, i quite often use cash is the issue. So I suppose i could contact them and show proof of the other visits to their store but will this help?

How i i then go about asking for an appeal to popla and what do i write to popla and appeal for? i think my strongest arguement is the fair charge, the car park is free and was half empty!

Thanks

Redx

ignore dr+ as they cannot do anything at all, parking eye might but dr+ cannot do a thing about this , arguing with them wont work either , they dont get paid if you dont pay them, hence why they want you to pay and will do anything underhanded to get money out of you

if PE send you an LBC or court papers , that is the time to act

in the meantime , yes you can prove patronage of morrissons even if not on the day in question, they dont want to lose repeat customers so you get them to cancel the ticket

you cannot appeal to popla without a popla reference issued by PE, so no code = no appeal

popla appeals are dealt with in post #4 of the NEWBIES sticky thread, concentrating on not a gpeol and no contract with the landowner etc

whilst the car park may be free to park, it has rules issued by PE and they will allege that you broke those rules, hence the charges

Stroma

Use the bank statements with Morrisons to show spend at their store, explain that you used cash on the day, say that you didn't keep the receipt as it's for food and not anything for guarantees or such, explain that you never thought of keeping receipts in case a third party company lurking in their car park would harass you.

Umkomaas

^^ +1 ^^

Go in 'hard' to Morrisons as a regular customer and complain. Have your bank statements to hand, but I wouldn't expose them unless/until they doubt you. This will give you a stronger hand.

Don't complain to the Customer Services' frump; demand to see the manager. Be assertive.

Coupon-mad

Jessica_fleet wrote: »

Thanks coupon mad yes i saw it today. Ideally i want to get out of paying it all together still keeping myself as the driver and am trying to keep the option of resetting the clock and using another driver

I didn't tell you to name another driver.