samsmoot and other following courtcase.

LittleAoife

some of you may remember that in January a seller that I bought an item from applied to the county court for the cost of their item after ebay gave me a full refund.
"Last month I made a purchase on ebay. The item was damaged and I messages the seller asking if I could return the item. The seller firstly said yes but they would only refund me the item cost, I threatened to open a case with ebay and then the seller said they were no longer able to receive a package at their address so could I send it elsewhere ( to a different address). I asked on here if this was ok and was advised to say no and report it to ebay. Thankyou quack quack oops!
I had already opened a case so again asked the seller ( on the case messaging) if I could return the item for a refund, the seller again asked me again to post to an alternative address. I explained to the seller that I was not prepared to do this as it is not ebay policy and I would have no way of proving that they had received the return.
The seller replied saying ' if you send it to the original address it will be returned and you will not get your refund'.
I then asked ebay ( through the escalation) to advise me of what I should do. Ebay offered me a full refund due to non compliance of the seller and sent me an email saying I was right to refuse to return to a different address and that they had given me a full refund.
Now the seller has sent me an email asking me to return the item anyway.
Update I contacted ebay with regards to the item and they said, now I have a refund the case is closed and it is my discretion as to whether I return the pram or not. I have again contacted the seller and offered to return the item to the correct address. They said that they would not accept the item being returned to this address as they were away travelling so it would be returned to me. I messaged ebay again who reiterated that it was to my discretion as I have had the refund.
I bought the replacement parts for the item and used it a few times but
The seller contacted me again and asked me to send the item to the origional address on the listing and not the alternative one. Ebay then suggested that as a good will token they will send me a pre paid postage label to cover the return postage. I packed up the pram to send back when I have a day off to wait for the courier.
I then received a phone call from the seller (they apparently got my number via ebay although I did not give ebay permission to send the my number) they said that they spoke to ebay via live chat and that ebay said it is theft and a criminal matter, they told me on the phone that ebay have agreed to take the money back from my paypal account and freeze my ebay account and contact the local police. I got upset and told the seller that ebay have stated clearly that it is my discretion as the whether or not the pram is returned. They called am a liar and asked me to prove it by sending them copies of my emails with ebay which I did. I offered to return the pram or to give them a partial refund back as I managed to replace the broken parts and was happy to keep the pram if I could refund them minus the cost to myself for the parts. The seller the sent me a notice of intention to take me to the court for the full amount for the item. They have said that as I used the item I have remained in contract with them for the item and now owe them this money, they said I admitted to using it now so I have to pay them.
They added to the cost of the item, court fees, their ebay fees, their paypal fees and it now is totaling over £450!!!!! It was only £375 for the item
I got really scared and paid them £300 this is all I have as a good will to draw a line under the whole situation.
I paid them the £300 via PayPal and wrote them an email in return stating that I felt it was only fair as they are refusing a refund that I pay the cost of the item minus the cost to myself for the replacement parts and that for me is my final off.
Now the seller has emailed to say that they don't accent the £300 ( although they have not returned this money to me via PayPal) and they will be proceeding to claim the additional £. 100 plus fees from the court and inform the police as I have stolen their property, in their email they copied in a quote which is from ebay which states ' this is a matter of theft and you need to call the police to get your item back from the buyer'.
They have headed all their correspondence to me with bold letter stating ' 'without prejudice' and I'm now really scared that 1.the police will come and recover the item and I will be liable for criminal proceedings and 2. They will also take me to court for the additional £100."


well.....they issued proceedings and the lovey samsmoot gave me some guidance as to what to write in my defence. I have been given a court date for july.
now the seller has sent me an email to my personal email account offering to draw a line under this thing without going to court if I pay the £100 plus their fees so far.
they have also stated that if I continue to proceed to the civil court they will then also contact the police so that I may be persued via criminal proceedings.
what shall I do???
I feel this is a threat to scare me into paying them the money and from a little bit of research I gather that once civil proceedings have been issued for matter they can not then be issued also as criminal as you cant have proceedings against you (either civil or criminal) for the same thing??
maybe Im wrong, help please.

theonlywayisup

Punctuation helps.

hollydays

I think this is verging on harassment if not blackmail I would be inclined to ignore it and ask for advice from the court office?

goodmorningsunshine

The seller was in the wrong or you would not have had your money refunded by ebay/paypal.

You have now paid them just short of their purchase price - why?

More or less an admission that the item was useable/repairable.

Not what you want to hear, I know and can sympathise as you panicked, but did you ask for advice before paying them some monies?

I fear you may well have been told to leave well alone.

If the item was damaged, and I had offered several times to return and they were being awkward, opened a case and won my money back, then that would be the end of it.

They are bullying you for the full amount.

Strapped

I think you should've returned the pram once you had your money back tbh or at the very least made it available for collection. Saying "ebay told me it was OK to steal it" is not really a defence in law.

campdave

In all seriousness, if you have been given a court date, it is advisable you seek proper legal advice rather than asking on the internet. Whilst the advice you will be given will be well meaning, it is possible you will be given incorrect information.

At the very least, you need to contact your local Citizen's Advice Bureau, explain the situation and let them tell you what the next step would be.

sequence

You should have returned the pram to the alternative address. Why make it so hard ? Sellers are free to have alternative Returns route etc. Although I can't see the seller getting any money in court, as the seller should have paid to have the faulty item collected / sent back.

RFW

LittleAoife wrote: »

now the seller has sent me an email to my personal email account offering to draw a line under this thing without going to court if I pay the £100 plus their fees so far.
they have also stated that if I continue to proceed to the civil court they will then also contact the police so that I may be persued via criminal proceedings.
what shall I do???

First, others advising what you should have done is no help at this stage.
For the police to do anything there would need to be some intent to defraud on your part, it's doubtful they'd get involved as it is a civil matter.
Further to other comments, seeking legal advice is the best option. Go to Citizen's Advice or a solicitor free advice day if you can't afford to pay for a solicitor. Make sure you keep/print out copies of all correspondence from the seller and have it to give in court.
I couldn't read all the initial part of your thread due to the layout, but if you are ahead financially and the seller's offer isn't a bad one you could pay that, you are also free to make a counter offer. Again, make sure everything is in writing, if you do end up trying to settle make sure you get confirmation and pay by bank cheque/draft, so there is a clear record.
All that said, don't take my advice from an internet forum, get face to face independent legal advice.

cattie

Why not pop into your local police station if possible & ask them if in their opinion they would be willing to arrest you for theft?

LittleAoife

goodmorningsunshine wrote: »

The seller was in the wrong or you would not have had your money refunded by ebay/paypal.

You have now paid them just short of their purchase price - why?

More or less an admission that the item was useable/repairable.

Not what you want to hear, I know and can sympathise as you panicked, but did you ask for advice before paying them some monies?

I fear you may well have been told to leave well alone.

If the item was damaged, and I had offered several times to return and they were being awkward, opened a case and won my money back, then that would be the end of it.

They are bullying you for the full amount.

I know I shouldn't have sent them the £300 but I was really frightened as they had my address, and phone number and were calling me and shouting at me down the phone etc. I was just scared. in heinsight I should have said no but I was scared.

LittleAoife

Strapped wrote: »

I think you should've returned the pram once you had your money back tbh or at the very least made it available for collection. Saying "ebay told me it was OK to steal it" is not really a defence in law.

so where does 'I packed up the item ready to be sent back' and ' I messages the seller asking if I could return the item.' mean I had the intention of stealing their item.