Tradesmen (plumbers handymen etc) and money

Tumtitums

My basic question is how do you go about paying tradesmen without them running off with your money

I am about to get my bathroom done and am quoted a 4 figure sum of money. All the tradesmen want either cash or the money transferred to their bank account. None accept visa debit or credit card and my bank says that any money transferred between accounts cant be reversed by them if i'm not happy with the work.

What steps can i take to make sue they dont run off with my money without completing the job properly. I have friends who say that if this happens there is little you can do as the tradesmen just ignore court letters and the police do nothing. This is assuming they have a business address. The ones i have come across so far want a deposit even before they star doing anything

Lukibird

If they don't have a business address or only have a mobile number be very wary. Make sure you get a written quote and agree a payment plan(in writing).
Perhaps if you pay for materials they have supplied as they go along then you should get the receipts before money changes hands. Obviously they will have put on a mark up.
Be wary of any that insist on full payment up front.
And if you are dealing with one who will only work cash in hand and wants money up front then watch out!

Lukibird

Should have said I am in the building trade. We certainly aren't all bad. Some of us take pride in our work

Doozergirl

I'd echo Lukibird's comments.

Also, please think of it the other way around. We don't actually take deposits unless we are ordering bespoke items, but even if we did, we will do £10k worth of work for our customer over the next two weeks alone. What do you think would happen to us if they didn't pay? Even if we'd taken 25% up front, we have subcontractors that need to be paid and materials that will be worthless as they are attached to someone's house. A deposit wouldn't cover it. You can check references, we can't.

Taking credit cards is relatively pointless for us - most people don't have credit card limits that high and a bank transfer costs nothing where a debit card and the associated rental of machines work out expensive, especially on large numbers.

Check references of your people. Not just paper, but call them. We are happy to provide three numbers and allow a potential customer to choose which one.

People are quick to condemn the trades, but if people are prepared, even keen to avoid VAT etc then there will be people willing to work that way. There are plenty of us reputable folk out there with companies, VAT registration, trade body membership, the ability to offer insurance backed guarantees, landlines and even, halleluia, no deposits.

trailingspouse

It's all about relationships - when I get quotes, I treat it as a chance to meet the tradesperson, and decide if I can work with them. Sort of like an interview.

For example
- will I be happy (as a woman) to be on my own in the house with them
- do they sound like they know what they're doing (some don't!!)
- are they charging a reasonable price - not too expensive, but also not too cheap (I prefer to use someone who can quote a daily rate, otherwise I just feel they're making it up as they go along)
- can they tell me how long the job will take
- can they give me a definitive start date.
- do they turn up in a liveried van (not absolutely necessary if everything else is OK, but it helps)
- and if they take their workboots off at the door, the job is theirs!!!

It's not all about price.

I pay all my trades by using the BACS system. They give me an invoice, and I pay it when the job is done. (and I agree - it works both ways, one of my guys had to ring me a couple of weeks after the job was done, cos I'd forgotten to pay!!) I wouldn't use someone who wanted cash or didn't have a bank account. I've only been asked to pay upfront for really big jobs (when we had the house re-wired, the total bill was £7000, and they asked for £2000 up-front, which seemed fair enough).

macman

Most small builders or sole traders won't take card payments simply because they would have to pay prohibitive merchant fees. That doesn't make them cowboys.

Prothet_of_Doom

Stage payments all the way.

This is how I spent 15K on my Loft conversion.
5 cheques to the builder's suppliers, for items he needed to pre-order. (That included the architectural technician, and the council fees)
These days I would ask to pay them by Bacs.
1 cheque to the builder on the day he started
1 cheque, when he finished the roof and the structure.
1 cheque when the stairs and plaster and electrics were done
1 cheque 30 days after completion, to cover snagging (there were none)
These days you'd do it by BACS.

Basically he got 4 stage payments for the completion of the preparation (ie on the day he started on site)
The completion of the weather proof structure when it was weather proofed
The completion of the job
The Profit he therefore deserved when it hadn't fallen down after 30 days.

nonnatus

I would expect to pay 30% on agreement that the work is to be done. This funds the materials etc.


I wouldn't then pay another penny until the job was finished to my satisfaction I'm afraid.

Prothet_of_Doom

trailingspouse wrote: »

For example
- will I be happy (as a woman) to be on my own in the house with them
- do they sound like they know what they're doing (some don't!!)
- are they charging a reasonable price - not too expensive, but also not too cheap (I prefer to use someone who can quote a daily rate, otherwise I just feel they're making it up as they go along)
- can they tell me how long the job will take
- can they give me a definitive start date.
- do they turn up in a liveried van (not absolutely necessary if everything else is OK, but it helps)
- and if they take their workboots off at the door, the job is theirs!!!

It's not all about price.

).

To add to this, with the loft, I asked for references of 4 firms, and went to visit 2 of EACH of their happy customers.
One came out quite badly, and one shone through, with customers who waxed lyrical about his style. (Basically, there was no mess, he started on the day he said, finished 2 days early, and never once asked for a cup of tea and declined offers of tea saying "tea break is at 11, and I've got a flask, so please don't offer again") Not the cheapest, but not a rip off either.

One day I came back to find him having a go at his electrian (He subcontracted that to the same bloke who got a regular day of work every 3 week) for leaving 'dust' in our hallway the previous day. I asked him about this and he explained that if he wants repeat business, my wife needs to tell her friends, and one spec of dust is all it takes to stop that happening.

theEnd

I've had a number of trades round recently. Picked from a mixture of on-line reviews and recommendations from friends.

Only the windows asked for anything up front and that was 20%.
Everyone else has billed what they quoted when the work was finished.

Tumtitums

Lukibird wrote: »

Should have said I am in the building trade. We certainly aren't all bad. Some of us take pride in our work

there are bad people in every profession its just that you are all unregulated and if someone walks off with my money theres effectively little way of getting it back . Im not so rich that i can afford to loose evenb 10% of the final job amount particularly considering the hourly job rates some charge