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BBQ141

They can't detain though they can only arrest. There is no such thing in law as "detention" for member of public.

They can use any person powers to arrest and then convey to a constable or a magistrate.

unholyangel

BBQ141 wrote: »

They can't detain though they can only arrest. There is no such thing in law as "detention" for member of public.

They can use any person powers to arrest and then convey to a constable or a magistrate.

So what are they doing when they arrest you until a police officer arrives? They're detaining you.

I suspect you're favouring the meaning that equates to being kept in a cell/held for questioning. It also means to hold back (ie I was detained at work with some last minute emergency).

gik

BBQ141 wrote: »

They can't detain though they can only arrest. There is no such thing in law as "detention" for member of public.

They can use any person powers to arrest and then convey to a constable or a magistrate.

Can you back that up by posting a link to the real world?

BBQ141

No, they are arresting you. In law the only reason you can be detained is by a constable (or in some cases by a person with the powers of an Officer of HMRC, or an Immigration Officer) for the purpose of a search under certain acts (for example a search by a constable under Section 23 of the Misuse of Drugs Act).

If they do not follow Section 24A of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 then it is considered false imprisonment.

I am not suggesting a person needs to be in a cell to be arrested but they do need to be arrested and told they have been arrested and why. You can't just hold onto someone (detaining them) until the police arrive.

They would also need to have SOCAP reasons for arrest which is something else totally.

To prevent the person in question: -
•Causing physical injury to themselves or any other person
•Suffering physical injury
• Causing loss of or damage to property,
OR
• Making off before a constable can assume responsibility for them,
(requires Reasonable Belief
to prevent person making off)

BBQ141

gik wrote: »

Can you back that up by posting a link to the real world?

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1984/60/section/24A

(1)A person other than a constable may arrest without a warrant—
(a)anyone who is in the act of committing an indictable offence;
(b)anyone whom he has reasonable grounds for suspecting to be committing an indictable offence.
(2)Where an indictable offence has been committed, a person other than a constable may arrest without a warrant—
(a)anyone who is guilty of the offence;
(b)anyone whom he has reasonable grounds for suspecting to be guilty of it.
(3)But the power of summary arrest conferred by subsection (1) or (2) is exercisable only if—
(a)the person making the arrest has reasonable grounds for believing that for any of the reasons mentioned in subsection (4) it is necessary to arrest the person in question; and
(b)it appears to the person making the arrest that it is not reasonably practicable for a constable to make it instead.
(4)The reasons are to prevent the person in question—
(a)causing physical injury to himself or any other person;
(b)suffering physical injury;
(c)causing loss of or damage to property; or
(d)making off before a constable can assume responsibility for him.

gik

...and what was that S.75 PACE nonsense you mentioned...oh dear are you related to hpuse?

BBQ141

gik wrote: »

...and what was that S.75 PACE nonsense you mentioned...oh dear are you related to hpuse?

S.75 PACE doesn't exist, and I am afraid I don't know who/what hpuse is?

gik

BBQ141 wrote: »

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1984/60/section/24A

You didn't actually answer my question.

BBQ141

gik wrote: »

You didn't actually answer my question.

Then I didn't understand your question, please clarify what you mean.

houseimprover

unholyangel wrote: »

A security guard has no more power/authority to detain you/lay hands on you/ask to see your receipt than I or any other random stranger.


However, stores have (supposedly - according to some threads on here) banned people who refused to cooperate with security.

I know some people get on their high horse and go on about how its the principle of the thing or about how embarrassed they were but really, its a simple request that can clear up any confusion and (imo) would be unreasonable to refuse.

I have banned someone from the store at I work at for not complying with our requests to find out what set our alarm system off.

There is very little I can do if they are uncooperative except ban them for the future and reduce the risk.

Though it is amazing how many thieves comply when I ask to find what set our alarms off.

Its human nature for people to obey people in perceived positions of power. It's been engrained in 99% of us.