Exceptionally high water bill (South West Water)

kisto

I have just received my latest water bill and it is exceptionally high - £116.50 a month :eek: It was already high previously (£76.50 a month).
From Aug - Feb we used 107 cubic metres.

I'm on a meter. Living in a small 3 bed house, with 2 teens. No dishwasher, no hosepipe, we shower instead of bath... (and no swimming pool, although I could probably have filled one at this rate)! :rotfl:

I originally called SWW about my supposed high consumption a couple years ago when the bill increased significantly. They asked me to do the leak checks - which I did and no sign of a leak. Then they sent me out a booklet to check my consumption and nothing seemed abnormal there. I was left feeling like I was obviously just a high consumption user and it was somehow down to me.

Now I know for a fact there is no way we could have used so much water.

I've just carried out a 1 hour leak check - nothing. Tonight I will do an overnight leak check. I suspect that will reveal nothing (it didn't last time).

Does anyone else have any ideas what I can do to get to the bottom of this? Are there any other checks we can do. The customer service guy said that it could be something like my washing machine using too much water - does this sound right or is he fobbing me off?

Cardew

Size of house is not a factor.


Sorry to say but your consumption is not 'exceptionally high'. In fact with 4 people in house, 107 cubic metres in 6 months is very slightly below average.


UK average is 55 to 60 cubic metres, per person, per year; so 220 to 240 cubic metres a year for a family of four.


Old washing machines can use a lot of water, as can long showers. Toilets can use loads as well.


On top of all that, the charges you pay in the South West are a disgrace.

kisto

Cardew wrote: »

Size of house is not a factor.


Sorry to say but your consumption is not 'exceptionally high'. In fact with 4 people in house, 107 cubic metres in 6 months is very slightly below average.


UK average is 55 to 60 cubic metres, per person, per year; so 220 to 240 cubic metres a year for a family of four.


Old washing machines can use a lot of water, as can long showers. Toilets can use loads as well.


On top of all that, the charges you pay in the South West are a disgrace.

It is exceptionally high compared to everyone I have spoken to locally. In fact I haven't found anyone who is paying anywhere near what I am paying or using as much water as I am - they have bigger households and more consumption (using hose pipes, dishwashers etc). The average person locally is paying £40 - £50 a month.
South West Water even wrote to me to tell me my consumption was high and suggested I check for a problem

Edit to add, see this: http://www.ccwater.org.uk/savewaterandmoney/averagewateruse/ <<< see this table. I am a 3 person household. Annual consumption of 175 cubic metres is considered high. If I used 107 cubic metres in 6 months that is 214 in a year.

Further edit to add: I have just used a few consumption calculators online. Even being generous with my estimates - it comes out as calculating my consumption to be 148 cubic metres a year.

Cardew

kisto wrote: »

It is exceptionally high compared to everyone I have spoken to locally.

I am a 3 person household. Annual consumption of 175 cubic metres is considered high. If I used 107 cubic metres in 6 months that is 214 in a year.

My figures were based on the assumption that 4 people were in the house.


So yes your consumption is high - but not IMO 'exceptionally' high.


The main culprits for a leak in a house are toilet cisterns overflowing(silently) back into the bowl and a cold water header tank overflow.


If not a leak, if your 'teens' are anything like mine were, long showers could be a reason.


As said above, older washing machines could use over 100 litres a cycle.


It might be an idea to measure a 24 hour period with a typical pattern of use to get an idea of consumption.


P.S.
A dishwasher, used wisely, can be more economical than frequent hand washing.

matelodave

Try reading your meter daily for a couple of weeks to see how much you use and when you use it.
It will help you identify where you can make savings. You can also try turning off your stopvalve for a few hours to make sure that there aren't any leaks.


Try taking shorter showers (5 mins max) or shallower baths, only use the washing machine & dishwasher with full loads. Don't let water run down the sink when washing, rinsing or cleaning your teeth. Ask your water co if they give away flow restrictors which can be fitted to your taps & shower hose to reduce the amount of water that comes out

kisto

matelodave wrote: »

Try reading your meter daily for a couple of weeks to see how much you use and when you use it.
It will help you identify where you can make savings. You can also try turning off your stopvalve for a few hours to make sure that there aren't any leaks.


Try taking shorter showers (5 mins max) or shallower baths, only use the washing machine & dishwasher with full loads. Don't let water run down the sink when washing, rinsing or cleaning your teeth. Ask your water co if they give away flow restrictors which can be fitted to your taps & shower hose to reduce the amount of water that comes out

Thanks matelodave - useful advice :beer:

phsci

Cardew wrote: »

On top of all that, the charges you pay in the South West are a disgrace.

Charges for an unmeasured account in the South West are certainly the highest in England and Wales, and by quite a margin, but the average bill for a measured account is much more in line with those levied in other parts of the country. The average unmeasured bill for 2013-14 in the South West was expected to be £811 (less the £50 Government contribution) but the average measured bill only £411, a ratio of 1.97. The average unmeasured bill in the Wessex area was forecast to be £560 and the average measured bill £410, a ratio of 1.37. The average unmeasured bill in the Anglian area was forecast to be £542 and the average measured bill £397, also a ratio of 1.37. The average measured bill in the area served by Southern Water (£430) is now actually higher than the equivalent in the South West. The financial benefits of moving to a meter for an average customer in the South West are clearly greater than elsewhere. Those customers who feel that their charges are a disgrace, but who have not opted for a meter, should give it very serious consideration.
(Figures taken from those published on the OFWAT website)

Cardew

phsci wrote: »

Charges for an unmeasured account in the South West are certainly the highest in England and Wales, and by quite a margin, but the average bill for a measured account is much more in line with those levied in other parts of the country. The average unmeasured bill for 2013-14 in the South West was expected to be £811 (less the £50 Government contribution) but the average measured bill only £411, a ratio of 1.97. The average unmeasured bill in the Wessex area was forecast to be £560 and the average measured bill £410, a ratio of 1.37. The average unmeasured bill in the Anglian area was forecast to be £542 and the average measured bill £397, also a ratio of 1.37. The average measured bill in the area served by Southern Water (£430) is now actually higher than the equivalent in the South West. The financial benefits of moving to a meter for an average customer in the South West are clearly greater than elsewhere. Those customers who feel that their charges are a disgrace, but who have not opted for a meter, should give it very serious consideration.
(Figures taken from those published on the OFWAT website)

Not sure how those figures for metered consumption in the South West are calculated; unless the very high prices drastically reduce consumption - which appears to be confirmed by the quote below from the South West Water website.

What is the average use per household on a meter?


Below are figures of the average annual use for different sized households based on the number of occupiers. The average has been calculated based on regular use of a washing machine and dishwasher and regular baths or showers.
Your usage may be lower or higher than this depending on the types of appliances you use and how often you use water for activities such as car washing or watering gardens.

1 Occupier household = 55 cubic metres

2 Occupiers household = 95 cubic metres

3 Occupiers household = 130 cubic metres

4 Occupiers household = 165 cubic metres

5 Occupiers household = 195 cubic metres

The charges for South West(2013/14) are £6.66 per cubic metre for full water and sewerage; plus standing orders of approx £75 pa.

http://southwestwater.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/172

So if a measured bill for SW water on average is £411, that indicates that the average household consumption is just 50 cubic metres pa (£411 - £75 = £336 divided by £6.66.)

So less than the average for a single person household.

Could it be that they are taking into account all the many thousand holiday cottages/accommodation etc??

Or perhaps in the rural South West there are many properties that have septic tank drainage??

Either way the Ofwat figure of £411 for the South West doesn't appear to make sense.

For instance Wessex Water show a near identical average charge for 2013/14 of £410 for metered properties.

Their charges for full water/sewerage are £3.98 per cubic metre plus £77 in standing charges. So applying the same principle for a near identical charge(£410) the average household bill is for a consumption of 84 cubic metres.

The bottom line is that a 'normal' house in the South West with, say, 3 people will have a consumption of 130 cubic metres pa. (using SW's figures) and have a bill of £941.

phsci

Cardew wrote: »

Not sure how those figures for metered consumption in the South West are calculated;
...........................................
Could it be that they are taking into account all the many thousand holiday cottages/accommodation etc??

Cardew: OFWAT's XLS spreadsheet is available at https://www.ofwat.gov.uk/consumeriss...latestchanges/ "average metered and unmetered bills". I'm afraid that they haven't explained the methodology used to produce these figures; I do hope that they specify it to the companies when they are asked to make their retuturns to ensure we are seeing apples compared with other apples. Your point about holiday cottages seems a very plausible explanation since presumably they do not enjoy 100% occupancy year-round. In any event, your analysis produces figures which seem more in line with people's reported experiences and, of course, less favourable to South West Water. Disgraceful!!

nickcc

We pay average of £220 per quarter to SWW for two of us with one only using shower and toilet flushed using the mellow yellow technique, unfortunately our small bungalow had the meter fitted before we purchased.

matelodave

nickcc wrote: »

We pay average of £220 per quarter to SWW for two of us with one only using shower and toilet flushed using the mellow yellow technique, unfortunately our small bungalow had the meter fitted before we purchased.

That sounds like a lot. Based on Cardews info that looks like about 120cum a year, nearly as much as an average three person household.. Do you read your meter regularly to check what you are using and to ensure that you don't have any leaks.
I'm sure you could save a bit if you monitored what you use and identified when it was being used. Try only using the washing machine & dishwasher with full loads. We run our dishwasher every other day and the washing machine 5-6 times every fortnight with full loads. We only manage to use about 75cum a year (less than 1.5cu.m a week) and we wash our cars, caravan and have an automatic garden watering system. We also flush the loo every time it's used - no mellow yellow for us. We are at home all day so we drink numerous cups of coffee so the loo gets used quite often.

We don't have a bath, just a shower and it's used daily. Check your shower flow rate - you can get a decent shower at about 5-6 litres/min (ie it should take about 2 mins to fill a 10l bucket) much more than that then a flow restrictor would help. A five minute shower at 5lpm uses 25 litres whereas a ten minute shower at 10lpm uses 100. You'll be just as clean with a shorter shower and it will save energy as well.