"Let go" without any notice

DK_abc

PHILANTHROPIST wrote: »

Hi again DK_abc .

I see that you are receiving some good tips re alternative employment.

If, however, ur partner is interested in potential justice, compensation, compromise and/or her "job" back then please consider and/or kindly answer following queries :

a) How was she paid ? Cash / cheque/ pay intervals ?

CASH

b) Who decided upon and/or had final decision on price of hairdressing services - ur partner or salon.... or mix of above ?

SALON

c) Could or did ur partner work for other hairdressing salons ?

NO she didn't and he probably wouldn't have disapproved if it was on her days off (she was part time - wed, thu, fri)

d) Holidays - did she have to, or did she give give salon owner reasonable notice ?

YES

e) When your partner was unavailable to work at the salon did she, or was she required/ expected to provide a replacement hairdresser who was then paid separately by your partner ... in legal terminology, this is called "substitution".

NO - But if she did have time off, which happened a couple of times prior to Xmas, she had to have a valid reason.

f) Would your partner say that she was for the main part, or even exclusively, under the control of the salon owner... i.e. did she have to follow the salon's specific working procedures, service and quality standards. Alternatively, did each individual hairdresser who "rented a chair" work to their own different styles and quality standards etc ?

SHE SAYS SHE WAS UNDER HIS CONTROL - What he said goes.

g) Was yesterday's telecon with salon owner overheard / witnessed, or better still did you tape it (technically a breach of human rights, but in circumstances taped evidence may well on balance be fine).

UNFORTUNATELY NOT (Although it did cross my mind when I realised it was really like she had been fired for) - I did make notes though and told him that. I am fast at typing.

h) When was partner on maternity leave and what notice was given, anything in writing, did she receive stat maternity pay - if so who paid it? Was her position / "chair" kept open for her ?

THERE WAS NO MATERNITY PAY (That's half the reason we are still and have been struggling for a while now - foolishly we fell in love with being parents and opted to have more time off than we had originally planned between ourselves - to spend time with our baby daughter - only child). I don't think her position was kept open for her as such. He just gave her a job when she asked again (because she's a good worker imho!).

i) Possibly not of major importance , but pl clarify following extract from ur opening statement, in particular pl define which specific party you are referring to...i.e ur partner, the boss, new hairdresser !? - “ She said there is one new person in the shop who is a full time, been there about 4 months and she had a falling out with him a couple of weeks ago saying he believed she had been putting false names in his column so she would get the next haircuts. She says twice people didn't turn up for him and both times it was her name next on the list... coincidence ?”

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I HAVE SPOKEN MORE TO HER ABOUT THIS and WHAT/WHY HAS HAPPENED.

I will try and be brief; A new person joined the salon about 4 months ago. As far as I know they all rent chairs. This person started complaining when the shop was having quiet periods. My partner tells me that it happens from time to time and is part and parcel of the salon but obviously when it is quiet they are not getting paid. She also tells me, with the salon being in a business area that some people do make appointments and not turn up for them. Apparently this happened a couple of times with the new guy, who had been vocal about the shop having quiet periods and at one point he questioned why when two people had not turned up it was m partner whos name was next on the list. He accused her of manipulating the book (ie putting false names in the book) so that he (the new guy) would be waiting for (his booked in) customers and any (casual) customers that came into the shop would go to my partner.

Some other parts I would like to say, not sure if they are important but; My partner has an excellent time keeping record. She turns up to work early and never used to miss a day, no matter how ill etc. That was one of her strong points. She is not business motivated as such.. she is however a good grafter and a polite sociable person (I might be slightly biased but we live in London and that is how people know her, that's her charm, unassuming, hard working, polite and punctual) hence she had built up a lot of regular clients. HOWEVER, our setup is I am freelance and do a lot of my work from home so she works wed/thu/fri 12-5 and I look after my daughter in those hours. Over the last few months from summer last year to Xmas I got a new client, very important and had to spend some of those days working away from home so for the most part we got family to cover but about 3-4 days over maybe 4-5-6 months she had about 4 days off. She always told him why. Apparently, he never said this to me on the phone but when she was asking why she had to go he said there were multiple reasons... one was that having part time people in the shop, if they take time off it means he makes no money. She shares her chair with another part time lady and thinks that he just wants to get rid of part time people. I am not sure what difference that makes if they are full time or part time but she said she thinks he wants to get rid of the part time people and bring in full time people and perhaps the new guy saying what he had said was a catalyst. She is certain her boss doesn't think she manipulated books to her advantage. And neither do I. We have a good relationship, she would have told me about it if she did.

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If you can answer some , if not all, of above, and also ask ur partner what outcome she ideally wants moving forward then I may be able to comment further or put in touch with some free and confidential services who may be able to offer further assistance.

Conversely, if legal rights/ options are not ur thing then pl let me know and I will back off and wish you and your family the very best for the future.

Well firstly thanks for your help. Secondly, we don't have the resources to challenge him legally and having just asked my partner your exact question she says she doesn't think he should be allowed to continue as he is, just firing people with no contracts. She has spoken to another ex employee asking if there was any work available anywhere and when the ex employee heard my partner had just been sent home on a wednesday night with no notice and no real explanation the other employee said that is exactly what he did to her as well. We have just been informed this very minute the reason he got rid of the last person was because she was part-time and he said he wanted to get full time staff. She had been there 5 years, maybe longer. And lastly my partner says she wants to be able to have a chance to say goodbye to her clients and let them know she is moving on and available if they want her to continue to cut their hair.

From my POV she worked there for 8 years excluding the birth of our daughter and she worked damn hard to build a good client base of regular customers. To get to 40 or 50 regulars who come in the shop and actually ask for you takes a lot of work. She is devastated by that.

She is adamant - or has had it drummed into her - there's no contract, that's how it is. He would win.

Personally.... I am not sure we want the hassle of a legal battle but without going too personal he has left us up a very deep creek....with no paddle. Probably way darker than anyone here can imagine and totally unfair imho.

Thanks again...

DK_abc

That's it.. we have no money for a lawyer.

spacey2012

I would put the effort in to turning it around in to her own shop.
She can contact anyone she feels like, even where contracts have been in place, such cases are thrown out very quickly from court.
She can advertise and poach as many clients as she wants, a sob story is the perfect lure.

paulineb_2

spacey2012 wrote: »

I would put the effort in to turning it around in to her own shop.
She can contact anyone she feels like, even where contracts have been in place, such cases are thrown out very quickly from court.
She can advertise and poach as many clients as she wants, a sob story is the perfect lure.

Not all. There are people who have been legally barred from taking clients from a salon when they move on, Id be very wary about trying to take clients with her without getting advice on this first.

paulineb_2

DK_abc wrote: »

That's it.. we have no money for a lawyer.

You dont need a lawyer, you can get advice from the CAB and its possible to take someone to ET if thats the route you want to go down without having to hire a solicitor.

zzzLazyDaisy

Just picking up on the maternity leave point.

You say that when she left there was no arrangements for her to return, but when she later asked to rent a chair again, he took her back because she was such a good worker. You also say that she was off work longer than the two of you originally intended, because you fell in love with being parents.

If that is a reasonable summary, could you tell us exactly how long her break for maternity reasons was (starting with her last day of work before the baby was born, and ending when she returned to normal working as a part-timer 3 days a week). Also what date did she return to work?

This information could be relevant and at least needs to be considered.

Daisy

Prothet_of_Doom

DK_abc wrote: »

Any advice on if she's allowed to contact her regular clients or how she would be able to go about it? As far as I know in the past when people have left they have been allowed to let their clients know they were leaving, going elsewhere etc. She has lost all of that. She's a nice polite lady, works hard, lot of clients ask for her... Just gone!

There's no contract in place, nothing that says "You can not work for any of our customers" etc? In fact they are not the customers of the salon. As she's self employed they are her customers.

I'd be suggesting setting up in business ASAP.

Prothet_of_Doom

She did self assessment via HMRC ?

notanewuser

Could you answer the questions about how she was paid, tax + NI, holidays and maternity leave, please?

DK_abc

I think we just want to let him know he was ungentlemanly, unloyal, disrespectful, zero management skills and that she never saw it coming and is totally devastated. Still full of tears now. Been kicked out of her comfort zone I guess. Maybe too comfortable for him? I don't know... I do try and see both sides. I don't even really know the guy myself.... wouldn't recognise him if he passed me in the street, well maybe I would now but... he's not been an important part of our life... just hers and I think she had respect for him and that's all just gone. She has been offered another job which she can start in about 6 weeks and I have knocked up some nice flyers which will be with us Monday and she is going to flyer the local area for mobile work. Maybe retrospectively it'll be a kick that was needed. Who knows? It leaves us without any money for a few weeks - no idea how we will get through that - just got up to date with landlord and now falling back into debt again no doubt - the banks will be the ones who make money from the situation - and she has no idea if the whole shop like her, don't like her or whatever. I think he's destroyed some of her confidence. She's now feeling as if maybe people were talking behind her back and she was too blind to even notice. She thought for the most part people in the shop were her friends. There are only one or two of the original people there. He has a high turnover of people he hires over three local shops, people moving from shop to shop and then months later they have just gone, no goodbyes.. she's not the first and won't be the last but it's really quite sad and she's now putting two and two together with other people... why they just went and never said goodbye etc. Thanks for your advice... will check back in later but alas... another hard worker will just take a beating and move on, a little bit wiser and a little bit poorer as a result. Thanks for all your help.