Garage has wrecked my car - and charged me for it

aaj123

Mark_Mark wrote: »

Do you honestly think they record all their phone calls to produce a written records later?

I am just being prepared for either situation. If they do, they cannot be selective in producing transcripts as I too have the date and time of my calls with them. But if they don't have any recordings, then how will they prove anything about me saying anything about oil light? On the contrary, I CAN prove what they said to RAC (as RAC has agreed to provide me all notes and transcripts of their discussions with the garage) and I CAN also prove the car was working before (insurance company will provide me full records of tracking device).

So I am comfortable whether or not the garage chooses to use phone call recordings.

Lum

Mark_Mark wrote: »

Why would the garage record their calls to you and if they had who's going to pay for them to produce the transcripts?

This.

The RAC may well provide transcripts of the calls between the garage and themselves, but they won't be providing transcripts of the calls between the garage and you for what should be obvious reasons.

aaj123

Mark_Mark wrote: »

How much is a scrap car worth theses days?

More than the £600 the OP paid to get it back?

Was anyone with you when the car was delivered back to you? You may need to prove continuity if you take this matter to court.

The garage delivered the car to my house in their tow truck (garage is only a mile from my house). Again tracking device records would prove that movement. But how does it matter who was with me when the car was delivered back?

Mark_Mark

aaj123 wrote: »

I am just being prepared for either situation. If they do, they cannot be selective in producing transcripts as I too have the date and time of my calls with them. But if they don't have any recordings, then how will they prove anything about me saying anything about oil light? On the contrary, I CAN prove what they said to RAC (as RAC has agreed to provide me all notes and transcripts of their discussions with the garage) and I CAN also prove the car was working before (insurance company will provide me full records of tracking device).

So I am comfortable whether or not the garage chooses to use phone call recordings.

Maybe they may come across this thread.

But to be honest any expert you employ my find in favour of the garage so you'd be wasting your time taking it to court. Your insurance records won't show anything about oil pressure will they?

Mark_Mark

aaj123 wrote: »

The garage delivered the car to my house in their tow truck (garage is only a mile from my house). Again tracking device records would prove that movement. But how does it matter who was with me when the car was delivered back?

So you have no one to provide evidence about its condition when it was returned to you?

Can you download your tracking data and what will it show?

Mark_Mark

Lum wrote: »

This.

The RAC may well provide transcripts of the calls between the garage and themselves, but they won't be providing transcripts of the calls between the garage and you for what should be obvious reasons.

Our OP seems to think all these will come free of charge if he needs them. I wonder if he has taken steps to secure this potential evidence.

aaj123

Mark_Mark wrote: »

Maybe they may come across this thread.

But to be honest any expert you employ my find in favour of the garage so you'd be wasting your time taking it to court. Your insurance records won't show anything about oil pressure will they?

No it won't but you raise a pertinent point about the law for which I am happy to receive advice. Assuming they have no phone recordings, How will they be able to claim my car had a problem with oil pressure at all? Would I be expected to prove my car didn't have an oil pressure problem? And if so, why restrict it to oil pressure alone - this argument could be stretched to me having to prove my car didn't have ANY problem at all. I can't think how anyone can prove such a thing?

On the contrary, without phone calls, the garage should have to prove why the could not get the car back in the state it was brought in. And its plain luck I have a insurance tracking device else I would have struggled to prove even that my car was in working order.

I am no legal expert and keenly look for advice but if a garage is not able to give the car back in the state that it was brought in, I'd be surprised if the burden of proof was not on them rather than me. And all thought this, the sticking point remains why they discussed engine seizure with RAC (a point easily proved) without ever discussing with me. Again do they need to prove that they did tell me OR do I need to prove that they did not tell me?

aaj123

Mark_Mark wrote: »

Our OP seems to think all these will come free of charge if he needs them. I wonder if he has taken steps to secure this potential evidence.

Yes I have. The insurance company tracking device records need not even be requested. I just have to login to my online account and download the driving history. They are available all the time.

As for RAC, yes I have spoken to them and they were quite happy to send this across if I drop them an email requesting the same. They don't really have to provide me voice recordings of phone calls (that may well be chargeable if I ask for it). They are going to send me all the notes they already have on their systems and that includes notes they wrote up after each of their calls with the garage.

Not saying this whole case will be easy bit some things are easier than you think.

Mark_Mark

aaj123 wrote: »

No it won't but you raise a pertinent point about the law for which I am happy to receive advice. Assuming they have no phone recordings, How will they be able to claim my car had a problem with oil pressure at all? Would I be expected to prove my car didn't have an oil pressure problem? And if so, why restrict it to oil pressure alone - this argument could be stretched to me having to prove my car didn't have ANY problem at all. I can't think how anyone can prove such a thing?

On the contrary, without phone calls, the garage should have to prove why the could not get the car back in the state it was brought in. And its plain luck I have a insurance tracking device else I would have struggled to prove even that my car was in working order.

I am no legal expert and keenly look for advice but if a garage is not able to give the car back in the state that it was brought in, I'd be surprised if the burden of proof was not on them rather than me. And all thought this, the sticking point remains why they discussed engine seizure with RAC (a point easily proved) without ever discussing with me. Again do they need to prove that they did tell me OR do I need to prove that they did not tell me?

I'll ask again what does your tracking device show and how does it work?

If it's just gps and they say they drove it back what then as you were alone?

When was the car last serviced?
Has any garage ever told you about oil pressure issues.

TrickyWicky

Seems to me that the op has been neglegently driving a nail for some time admitting that it won't go without a bit of gas being applied. Autos are supposed to start creeping the moment you take your foot off the brakes. If not then something is wrong - brakes, oil, engine stiffening etc. The first thing you do is check the oil in the engine and autobox (some autoboxes are sealed for life though so you can't check them) and if you can, the brakes.

So op took car to the garage knowing full well its not right, they've not been fussed about the oil and left it with the garage to sort. Something seems fishy here if you ask me. Every garage will take a car for a test drive if there is something affecting its road performance. You can't then turn around and blame your neglect on them test driving it and it subsequently seizing.

Op claims this isn't a coincidence.. actually it may well be as these things do happen. I had an ignition coil go on a car after an engine overhaul and I'd not even touched the coil. Sometimes tinkering with something else will upset another problem. If the engine had been starved of oil then it was a ticking time bomb until it seized - I've had this happen too.

As frustrating as it is, I personally believe the RAC are at fault here and not the garage. The RAC have asked for the engine to be dismantled so they can inspect it knowing full well that costs would be incurred. If the RAC were not happy to foot the bill they should not have requested it OR they should have done it in-house which raises another point.. I suspect the op was supposed to let the RAC do their own work yet they opted for a local garage :sigh:

Sorry op but I think you're onto a looser here. I appreciate you're in a screwed situation but something basic like checking the oil once a month isn't rocket science and its now cost you dearly.

From my POV it looks like you're trying to pin the blame on someone so you can force them to foot the bill for your lack of maintenance.