Penalty for non-disclosure of driver details

MrPez

Bit of a warning as much as anything else...

Back in March last year one of our company vehicles was caught speeding. 58 days after the offence we received the first notice of intended prosecution. As this was well outside the 14 day period I ignored the letter (which I now realize was the wrong thing to do). They sent another letter and I responded saying that due to the time lapse we didn't know who the driver was (clearly they didn't believe this, although it was actually the case). So we then received court proceedings and it turned out that the police had sent out an initial NIP (within the 14 days) but they sent it to the previous owner as the DVLA records hadn't been updated when we bought the vehicle (a year prior). We didn't have to attend court and so claimed in writing that since the registered keeper had not been notified within the 14 days that there could be no prosecution.
Today I received a Collection order for £1185 with no justification or reasoning, or any details of the courts decision.

So while I'm more than a little annoyed, I thought I'd point out that it isn't worth trying to argue the point, even when you think you're justified.

Joe_Horner

Have you received a V5 for the vehicle? If so then DVLA must have been notified and have screwed up - you should be seriously looking at getting it set aside.

Aretnap

You mucked that up in almost every way possible I'm afraid.

First of all, if the NIP is late it gives the driver (whoever that might be) a defence to the speeding charge, it doesn't invalidate the requirement to name the driver. by not naming the driver you commit a new offence, and the fact that the NIP was late becomes largely irrelevant.

Secondly if the old keeper was still showing on the DVLA database, that's the person on whom the NIP must be served within 14 days. Even if it wasn't your fault that the record was incorrect, it wasn't the police's fault either, so the 14 day thing is irrelevant.

Thirdly, while there's a defence to non-disclosure of driver details if you could not, with reasonable diligence have found out who was driving, when it's a limited company that's accused there's an additional requirement to show that the failure to keep a record of the driver was reasonable (linky). There's a strong presumption that a company should keep a record of who drives its vehicles, so if you didn't keep a log then the defence was always likely to fail.

The £1185 will be £1000 fine, an additional 10% victim surcharge, and £85 prosecution costs for a case proved in absence. The one plus point is that normally there'd be 6 points as well - but as a company doesn't have a driving licence it can't get points. To compensate for the lack of points, when a company is convicted the fine will usually be close to the maximum allowed (£1000).

Aretnap

Joe_Horner wrote: »

Have you received a V5 for the vehicle? If so then DVLA must have been notified and have screwed up - you should be seriously looking at getting it set aside.

Doesn't matter if the DVLA screwed up - even if the NIP should have arrived within 14 days, the fact that it didn't wouldn't help with a s172 charge.

The company can appeal to the crown court within 21 days of the conviction if they want to keep fighting, but unless they can give a good reason why they didn't have a record of who was driving, at the very least, it will just mean an extra few hundred pounds in costs.

MrPez

We do have the V5 and it shows us as the registered keeper.
Just another costly learning curve.
We are a small business and don't keep records of drivers (I wasn't aware that we had to). In the past when we have had similar issues, the NIP has come quickly enough that we can remember who the driver was. There are only about 5 possible drivers. Problem here was that with the length of time involved we genuinely couldn't remember. I invited the police to provide further evidence (ie photo) but they didn't reply.

vaio

I'd get over to http://forums.pepipoo.com/

Joe_Horner

Aretnap wrote: »

Doesn't matter if the DVLA screwed up - even if the NIP should have arrived within 14 days, the fact that it didn't wouldn't help with a s172 charge.

The company can appeal to the crown court within 21 days of the conviction if they want to keep fighting, but unless they can give a good reason why they didn't have a record of who was driving, at the very least, it will just mean an extra few hundred pounds in costs.

"Your Honour, of course we keep records and they're just as reliable as the DVLA ones in this instance"