UKPC moorgate bury

TraderDave

Hi all, first post here and I'd like to say thank to the hard work of the regular posters. I've learnt a ton and it makes me even more disgusted at the tactics that these so called parking 'operators' use.

I recently received a leaving site ticket on a car park which is two hours max but with no charge thereafter and no pay and display. I ignored the initial windscreen ticket and have now received a NTK.

I've now drafted my initial soft appeal letter using this site which hopefully someone will check over for me. Any comments appreciated.

Dear UKPC,

I’m in receipt of your parking invoice dated XXXX and acknowledge that I was the registered keeper on the date of the alleged infringement. I wish to invoke your appeals process as all liability to your company is denied on the following grounds:

1. There is no fee payable at Moorgate Retail park so therefore the amount being claimed is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss.

2. Your signage does not comply with the BPA code of practice, 2012 Version 2 Appendix B.

3. You are not the landowner and do not have the capacity to offer contracts or to bring a claim for trespass.

These points and numerous others will be raised with POPLA should you not accept this appeal, and you will also be expected to provide a full breakdown of your alleged loss, and your full unredacted contract with the landowner.

If you do reject the challenge and insist on taking the matter further I must inform you at this stage that I may claim expenses from you that are not exhaustive but may include the cost of stamps, envelopes, travel expenses, legal fees etc.

Please reply to this challenge within 14 days of receipt as per BPA code of practice part 22.8.

Please issue your cancellation or forward a POPLA appeal form AND a POPLA verification code within 35 days of receipt of this letter.

Any communication that does not either confirm cancellation or include a POPLA verification code shall be reported to the BPA as a breach of their code of practice section 22.12. The BPA recently issued guidance to all members to remind them of this fact.

Yours faithfully.

XXXX

Redx

looks good to me, its similar to the stroma one I regularly post in replies on here

ezerscrooge

Follow the advice here and you'll beat these at this car park - I did.

I've put a complaint in to Bury Council Planning as the planning submission for Home Bargains refered to ..

" 9.6 The site is an established retail destination in Bury located within the town centre and directly adjacent to The Rock and the defined MSA. It follows that the development can benefit from existing travel patterns within Bury and it provides genuine opportunities for linked trips to occur between the proposed and existing retail operations.

9.7 The opportunity for customers to link trips between similar retail and other commercial operations means that the proposed development could help to reduce the overall
number of journeys and distance travelled by private modes of transport, thus reducing the level of carbon dioxide emissions. "

This 'leaving site' lark clearly goes against the linked trips and reducing journeys bits.

TraderDave

Thanks for the replies.

Ezerscrooge,

I've also sent an email to the council asking for clarification on parking guidelines for the retail park but I think what you've got there is pretty good.

I'll post today and wait for my rejection letter.

TraderDave

This is the reply I received when I asked bury council planning dept. about guidelines for the retail park. I'm pretty new to this so probably barking up the wrong tree in the first place.

"Good Afternoon,

There is no planning permission needed for how car parks are operated. This is a private company on private land who can operate the car park with their own guidelines."

Short and sweet.

ezerscrooge

It could be claimed that the council have been misled in the original application - points that may have swayed the granting of planning permission.

I'll give them a poke again on the planning submission points. Just to stir things up.

Coupon-mad

Look at this terrible 'half-advice' on CAG yet again to a similar post:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?415362-UKPC-Moorgate-Bury

They have confused the poster into thinking he should ignore the whole thing - and even when clarifying, a poster says
'I would wait until you get a letter through the post as a notice to keeper and then write back and tell them emphatically that you wer in KFC at the time'

'Wait for the NTK' they say (correct), then 'write and tell them you were there'...!!!!!!?! He also says 'There is no such penalty as leaving the site'. What on earth does he mean by that seeing as it's not a penalty and how does he know what silly excuses UKPC have to issue their fake PCNs?!

No-one has pointed that poster to how to win at POPLA, nothing to tell him what to say in the first appeal, nothing about 'GPEOL' or 'UKPC have no standing' as a clue for how he can win a POPLA appeal! Not even 'complain to the Store Mangers to get it cancelled'!


TraderDave, I would forget the Council & Planning Permission - this is a fairly old car park, not a new site where any rules will have been imposed by planners. Complain to the Store Managers though as they can get it cancelled over the phone in many cases (that's what the sticky thread 'Successful Complaints about PPCs' is all about).

TraderDave

Thanks coupon-mad, looks like they've been busy at moorgate recently. I'll take your advice on the planning issue. I'll just wait until I get my response from ukpc, with the added peace of mind that the leaving site tickets seem to be one of the easier ones to get cancelled.

ezerscrooge

Main thing is getting your ticket wiped out.

I have the landowners planning submission statement on why food items can be sold on site (2010) and the earlier points are in the document - but it maybe slight of hand and unless there are formal conditions attached to the PP then it probably won't get far with Planning.

The PPC/Landowner appear to have played a mean trick - when Home Bargains opened the PPC signs did not state a 'leaving site' bit. This happened in October when the signs got changed (they must have seen a nice money earner).

So they've lured people onto the site for a couple of months without the 'leaving site' element, then sneakily changed the parking terms and got busy ticketing.

The retailers are not interested - even their own staff have been stung if they forget to display a parking permit.

Coupon-mad

TraderDave wrote: »

Thanks coupon-mad, looks like they've been busy at moorgate recently. I'll take your advice on the planning issue. I'll just wait until I get my response from ukpc, with the added peace of mind that the leaving site tickets seem to be one of the easier ones to get cancelled.

Don't forget that at POPLA stage you won't even be arguing about whether you left the site. That's not what will win at POPLA.

ezerscrooge

CM is right. It really does not matter what you do - leave site, starddle 2 bays, stay all day etc. You'll win the case on no GPEOL, like me.

Then you'll get a letter from POPLA telling you the appeal has been allowed. This will be followed by a letter of apology from UKPC stating that, in these circustances, they have decided to cancel the charge.