Buying Grade II Listed house

Stepney

Hi,

I am close to exchanging on the purchase of a new home which happens to be a Grade II listed building in a conservation area. After solicitor queries it appears the vendor removed a structural wall from the basement kitchen, and replaced two glazed doors without planning permission.

My solicitor states this is a criminal offence and he advises caution as if i purchase i may be liable for putting the changes right. Another option is to take indemnity insurance - however this maybe specialist and not available.

Is it worthwhile going through and applying for retrospective permission? Is indeminity insurance adequate? Should I ask the vendor to apply for planning permission?

The vendor is in a chain, as am I as I am selling my flat - so the risk is this can scupper it all.

Any help appreciated.

Thanks!

SG27

This is a tough one. You could be liable for returning the property to its previous layout if you purchased. You could ask the vendor to get retrospective planning permission but I doubt they will be keen as if it's refused he will then have to change it all back. You could explore the idea of the indemnity policy, I have no idea if this type are available or not so can't help in that respect. In the meantime make sure you don't contact the council or conservation officer about it otherwise any indemnity policy would be invalid.

Stepney

I'm afraid the council is already aware as I checked previous planning permissions, namely the removal of the wall, and they said none were given - so appears the indemnity cover is a non starter...!?

SG27

Stepney wrote: »

I'm afraid the council is already aware as I checked previous planning permissions, namely the removal of the wall, and they said none were given - so appears the indemnity cover is a non starter...!?

Yes unfortunately that rules out an indemnity policy. Maybe now they are aware anyway see if they can advise you on the prospects of retrospective permissions or perhaps even if they are planning on any enforcement action?

DaftyDuck

Listed building consent is very variable, as it is in the hands of the local officer, and the variability of how strictly the apply the rules is a matter of complete chance. I have had a conservation officer who was difficult and obstructive merely because he had had - and expected continuing aggro from - a near neighbour with a lot of money & clout (related to an ex-MP). So, he was absolutely meticulous & difficult with us. I've also had a couple who were extremely helpful and willing to discuss all sorts of options & intentions over a cuppa, and who took me through my own building pointing out old fascinating features I was unaware of. So, variable....


HOWEVER, the real warning sign in your OP to me is that the current owner, despite living in a listed building, has attacked the structure and listed status without asking. Firstly, this suggests he might have known the C.O. would object (so is more likely to get on your backs over it).. but secondly, if they've done that, what else have they done that's not been spotted? Dodgy electric work? Botched plumbing? Other shortcuts?

If you go ahead, do so with eyes wide open. Oh, and knock the price back to rectify those two that have been spotted.

Stepney

Thanks for the very useful replies... My mortgage survey of the property was done before the solicitor checks uncovered this issue. Will this affect my mortgage approval on this property? I was lead to believe the mortgage company would request an indemnity policy in the least.

Debt_Free_Chick

Planning permission is not necessarily the issue - it's Listed Building Consent that you need to be concerned with. LBC applies far more widely than PP.

It's a specialist & complex area and I'd rely on the words of no-one ... except the Conservation Officer at the local planning authority ie the one applicable to the building. The CO is essentially in the driving seat when deciding what is and is not acceptable for changes to listed buildings. They are most likely to want to visit the building and see the changes - and they will then determine whether those changes have affected the character or appearance of a building of special interest.

This article from English Heritage gives and plain & simple overview of changes to Listed Buildings

I'd want the CO to visit and "rule" on whether the changes are acceptable, in the presence of the vendor. If not acceptable, then either the vendor makes it right at their expense. Or, if you are up to it, you put it right, but with the cost of doing so reflected in the price.

The vendor may not agree to the CO inspection. But if they don't, there's a good chance that the CO will be on to them soon in any event, as their colleagues in Planning now know that the internal wall has been removed in a Listed Building. They may well send a "did you that ...." message/email to the CO.

If you want to check whether they had LBC, you should be able to do that on the local planning authority's website. You may have to specifically search for LBC applications rather than applications for PP as the two consents are entirely different. You never know ... they might have had LBC, although I wouldn't be getting any hopes up on that.

HTH

SG27

Debt_Free_Chick wrote: »

Planning permission is not necessarily the issue - it's Listed Building Consent that you need to be concerned with. LBC applies far more widely than PP.

It's a specialist & complex area and I'd rely on the words of no-one ... except the Conservation Officer at the local planning authority ie the one applicable to the building. The CO is essentially in the driving seat when deciding what is and is not acceptable for changes to listed buildings. They are most likely to want to visit the building and see the changes - and they will then determine whether those changes have affected the character or appearance of a building of special interest.

This article from English Heritage gives and plain & simple overview of changes to Listed Buildings

I'd want the CO to visit and "rule" on whether the changes are acceptable, in the presence of the vendor. If not acceptable, then either the vendor makes it right at their expense. Or, if you are up to it, you put it right, but with the cost of doing so reflected in the price.

The vendor may not agree to the CO inspection. But if they don't, there's a good chance that the CO will be on to them soon in any event, as their colleagues in Planning now know that the internal wall has been removed in a Listed Building. They may well send a "did you that ...." message/email to the CO.

If you want to check whether they had LBC, you should be able to do that on the local planning authority's website. You may have to specifically search for LBC applications rather than applications for PP as the two consents are entirely different. You never know ... they might have had LBC, although I wouldn't be getting any hopes up on that.

HTH

I expect in this instance by planning permission the op means LBC as planning permission isn't normally required for removing walls or changing windows.

I'm not sure if this will effect your mortgage but if your solictor is acting on behalf of the mortgage provider too then I expect they would inform them.