Agricultural tie on property

beefster

Very possibly.
Maybe as it was an internal transfer via a will within the family it was assummed we knew? I dont know.

I am now looking at finding a solicitor to try and get the 10 year - Cert of lawful use applied for however...
1. Differant members of the family have lived there - does it have to be one person continually?
2. There was a period of approx one year where it was not habitable and i was refurbishing it. Does that effect the "continual" aspect.
3. Would the fact that it has not been occupied by anyone working in agriculture, nor has the farm been worked since the late 70's mean we could claim 10 years continual previously?

Straw clutching a bit.

Anyone know any good sol's in this field?

Ta

GDB2222

I don't know for sure, but my guess would be that different people would count towards the 10 years. It's the usage that counts, not who used it.

Davesnave

GDB2222 wrote: »

I don't know for sure, but my guess would be that different people would count towards the 10 years. It's the usage that counts, not who used it.

This is how I understand the matter. I also believe that the 'clock' starts again whenever there is a significant break in the habitation, such as happened during the refurbishment.

I think the OP is wise to be looking for a solicitor well-versed in these matters. A reputable local agent known for dealing in agricultural properties would be one place to look for recommendations, or try a few, to see if the same name crops up. That's what I did. Might help reduce problems with the inevitable old boy network!

GDB2222

If I understand the chronology, Grandparents received the building in 1985, did not farm, and lived there until fairly recently. Surely, that's the 10 years dealt with, ie 1985 to 1995?

Davesnave

GDB2222 wrote: »

If I understand the chronology, Grandparents received the building in 1985, did not farm, and lived there until fairly recently. Surely, that's the 10 years dealt with, ie 1985 to 1995?

I not sure that one may apply for the lifting of a tie based on someone else's non-compliance, but I could be wrong. I wish planning officer could advise here!

Perhaps OP could try a PM to planning officer, who appears earlier in this thread.

Mojisola

beefster wrote: »

My grandmother was left the bungalow by her employer as she had been the house keeper and nursed the owner for years to her death in 1985.

My grand parents lived there for many years with no farming etc being undertaken. All the associated land was left to the RSPCA and sold off. So it is a bungalow, barn, derlect chicken sheds and 5 acres of hay field.

This now continues with my occupancy. I have lived there for 4 weeks after a year where the property was refurbished and was empty.

Looking through this - https://www.parliament.uk/briefing-papers/SN00470.pdf - it looks as if you should have a strong case.

The property wasn't occupied by an agricultural worker for the whole time your grandparents lived there. Unless the chicken sheds are huge, it doesn't sound as it the amount of land around the house is enough to earn a living from agriculture. You certainly wouldn't get planning permission for a new house on the grounds of an agricultural holding of that size.

beefster

Thanks all... some interesting points.
I have phoned a "no win no fee" sol advertising on the net - he was very convincing and seems to know his stuff, used to be a planning officer but... is not in my area and did not see this as a problem? £3500 all in?

Sol does not see the break as an issue as there was no heating or drainage on site and it was therefore not habitable.
After speaking to my mother tho......
My Grandmother and grandfather lived there. Grandmother used to work for previous owner - Home help and... maybe crucially helping to look after the chickens and gardens from which some produce was sold. But it was 30 years ago and when they moved into the bungalow the farm had been shut down, land sold off etc. Although she still kept a few chickens it was not a business. Could be awkward. Grandmother died in 2006 whist still living at the property but retired. Since then my brother continued to live there and we had a year empty while refurbished and i moved in. So worst case we are 6 years into the 10 towards the cert for lawful use path.

The chicken sheds are quite large and currently only ised as storage space.

Optimistic but obviously sol's want you to go for it.

Thanks for the interest and ideas and thoughts. A little more optimistic now.

Mojisola

beefster wrote: »

Grandmother used to work for previous owner - Home help and... maybe crucially helping to look after the chickens and gardens from which some produce was sold.

This wouldn't have fulfilled the ag tie condition - a home veg garden wouldn't count and it sounds as if the chickens would only have been a part of her job - not the main part of her income.

It sounds as if the tie was broken years ago.

GDB2222

beefster wrote: »

Thanks all... some interesting points.
I have phoned a "no win no fee" sol advertising on the net - he was very convincing and seems to know his stuff, used to be a planning officer but... is not in my area and did not see this as a problem? £3500 all in?

Sol does not see the break as an issue as there was no heating or drainage on site and it was therefore not habitable.
After speaking to my mother tho......
My Grandmother and grandfather lived there. Grandmother used to work for previous owner - Home help and... maybe crucially helping to look after the chickens and gardens from which some produce was sold. But it was 30 years ago and when they moved into the bungalow the farm had been shut down, land sold off etc. Although she still kept a few chickens it was not a business. Could be awkward. Grandmother died in 2006 whist still living at the property but retired. Since then my brother continued to live there and we had a year empty while refurbished and i moved in. So worst case we are 6 years into the 10 towards the cert for lawful use path.

The chicken sheds are quite large and currently only ised as storage space.

Optimistic but obviously sol's want you to go for it.

Thanks for the interest and ideas and thoughts. A little more optimistic now.

£3,500 sounds like quite a bit for the work. Usually with no win/ no fee you pay at least double if successful. I'd ask a local solicitor for an estimate. It might be more like £500-1000, but payable regardless of success.

Itismehonest

Davesnave wrote: »

Sorry, I did not mean to imply that we are under threat of eviction, only that our council seems pretty 'relaxed' about compliance with ag-ties, as shown by their disinterest in our prior qualification to be here. We are officially retired now.;)

It's not beyond the bounds of possibility that other councils are similarly slack.

Some aren't, though, Dave.
http://www.devon24.co.uk/news/warning_to_others_as_couple_receive_hefty_fine_1_1426146

Take good legal advice, folks. It can obviously be very costly to go against the planning.