Claiming against BA

Justuk

Caz3121 wrote: »

To depart @ 5pm, the plane would need to arrive in Turin before 5pm - eg when ATC were on strike

This is true. As the strike as between the hours of 13-17. It is possible to have a variety of different scenarios. (I will add some later, short of time at the min).

Under Article 5, point 3 is the following;:
3. An operating air carrier shall not be obliged to pay compensationin accordance with Article7, if it can prove that the cancellation is caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken

The inbound flight to Turin was due to land at 16:15, turn around time of 45 mins. If the inbound flight was delayed by 1 hour (a reasonable delay), my flight could have departed around 6 and made time up onroute to UK.

In my case the cancellation could have been avoided if delayed for 1 hour as the strike would have ended

Justuk

In the list of extraordinary circumstances is also the following note.

Note 4: After demonstrating the existence of extraordinary circumstances, the air carrier must also explain what reasonable measures it took to subsequently avoid the disruption

Cancellation vs a 1 hour delay seems to me to be an extreme measure

Caz3121

I would not fancy your chances in court much (which is where you are likely to end up) I would expect a judge to side with BA in this case
Have you tried claiming for the car hire change via your travel insurance. Did you even ask about transport from Heathrow to Gatwick?

Justuk

Caz3121 wrote: »

I would not fancy your chances in court much (which is where you are likely to end up) I would expect a judge to side with BA in this case
Have you tried claiming for the car hire change via your travel insurance. Did you even ask about transport from Heathrow to Gatwick?

I think like most people who first visit these forums, I DID NOT KNOW MY RIGHTS. I was getting back to the UK and I thought that’s all I was entitled to. To complain to BA you need to speak to the customer relations department (9:30 - 5:30). I received my email at 5:27pm, I spent hours trying to speak to someone on the customer relations team but had no joy.

Article 14, point 2 states I should have been informed of my rights. Having spoken to a few BA staff on the phone and submitted complaint forms, no one informed me of my rights.

[FONT=&quot]My travel insurance only covered medical.[/FONT]

JPears

Justuk wrote: »

Article 14, point 2 states I should have been informed of my rights. Having spoken to a few BA staff on the phone and submitted complaint forms, no one informed me of my rights.

I don't know ANYONE on this forum that has ever received a copy of these consumer rights under the regulation when cancelled or delayed at the airport.
A point the CAA have singularly failed to take up any airline on AFAIK.

Justuk

I might be looking at this from completely the wrong angle but hopefully after referring the issue to the Italian civil aviation authority, I will be able to share what I learn.

Points:
- At 17:00 GMT+1 there was no strike.
- An airline has to take all reasonable measures to avoid long delays and cancellations

What is deemed as a reasonable measure??
a) The airline could have charted a plane to land in Turin before the strike, to allow the plane to depart at 17:00 GMT +1 (does not seem very reasonable for the airline)

b) The outbound flight from Gatwick could have been move to depart at 10:00 GMT instead of 13:30 GMT. The returning flight could have stayed on time. Allowing both outgoing and returning passengers to fly (Not sure how many people can fit on a Boeing 737 but that would allow around 500 people to fly). Reasonable??)

c) The Outbound flight could have been delayed for 1 hour (below the two hour threshold to pay assistance) departing at 14:30 GMT therefore landing in Turin at 17:15 GMT+1 (after the strike). 45 mins to turn plane around as returning flight leaves at 18:00 GMT+1. Both outbound passengers and returning passengers get to fly with minimal disruption. (this seems very reasonable to be)

d) The outbound flight departs at 16:00 GMT (after the strike so Italian airspace has reopened, before departure). Arriving in Turing at 18:45 GMT+1 (45 mins turn around time). Returning flight departs at 19:30 GMT + 1 (2.5 hours delayed, above threshold for assistance. Seems less reasonable than C.

e) What actually happened, cancel two flights blocking people from travelling on the 18th October. Delaying people returning from Italy by 15 hours. Send them to a different airport (not the final destination on the original ticket), no once informing me of my rights.

For me option e seems the worst option. You might have a different opinion or we might agree that C seems the most reasonable measure, either way I will send off my complaint and keep you posted.

Bye for Now and thank you for your replies

Caz3121

c is completely impractical. Many airports have a maximum capacity for number of arrivals/departures. Turin had 8 arrivals cancelled in that time period. ATC is not just to land the aircraft but to guide them through the airspace so it is not a case of "lets delay all the flights so they all get to the airport just after ATC is back up, to join the other 8 flights that were due to land in that same hour" If this was across Italy, you are not just looking at the Turin flights being affected.
Having worked for an airline in the past, these decisions on cancellations are not taken lightly. It is unfortunate when there is only one flight a day to a destination but when this is outside the airlines control their hands are often tied. There are ATC slots issued and it can be difficult to get another one. I have been on a flight that missed it's slot and had to sit onboard for another 2 hours waiting on ATC to issue another slot. The airlines cannot just choose to take off when they like. The slots for your inbound and outbound aircraft were likely cancelled so what can the airline do. Sit people on a plane for hours to see if they manage to get another slot?