Refused early retirement, ill health & transfer !

shelley17

Hope it's ok to start new thread to update one I started weeks ago.
To summarise, husband laid off job after 30 years service due to work place accident. This was approx 7 years ago.

At 50 we asked for early retirement (this was when law permitted) but the trustees refused on grounds of being detrimental to the fund.
On several occasions in the past we asked about ill health retirement, but they just say they'll get back to us and never do.

Now, aged 55 we asked again for them to consider either a) an actuarially reduced pension or b) deferred pension on grounds of ill health.
They've responded by refusing a) and in response to b) have ignored the question completely !

The trustees are also the directors/owners of the business. The pension is a final salary scheme. Now, we're fully aware that transferring out would be madness, however we are desperate for money.
My husband isn't disabled enough to qualify for any benefits apart from a small industrial injuries benefit and at 55, is unemployable with many health conditions. He is self employed as that's the only way he can get an income.

He paid into this pension since he was 21 and now that he needs it, we can't get it.
We got an IFA who was prepared to treat us as an insistent client, as obviously he advised against the transfer.
All the forms were prepared and submitted for an enhanced annuity, but now the trustees have refused to sign the transfer papers as they say once again it's detrimental to the fund!

Now unlike previous years quotations of guaranteed transfer values, this current one didn't have any reductions due to the schemes assets being insufficient to pay full transfer value.

Can they refuse to transfer?
Also, with regards to ill health, I have a letter from AXA dated 2006 (pension is now with Friends Life) which states the rules do NOT contain a definition of incapacity but the definition generally accepted is that outlined in the inland revenue practice notes i.e not being able to do his or her normal employment or which seriously impairs his or her earning capacity.

So, do we have grounds to appeal against their decision to refuse the transfer? If we don't, I assume we'll have to follow a grievance procedure as to why they always evade the request we originally had for ill health.
I know it's logical financially to go the ill health route, but the relationship between my OH and trustees is awful. They will hinder, delay and do everything they can, so that, as in the past we get so stressed, we give up.
So sorry for long post but needed to get it off my chest.
We're told to make provision for old age or ill health, yet when we do, we're penalised.

quotememiserable

It sounds like you should refer the case ill health claim to the pensions ombudsman, or perhaps write and tell the trustees this is what you will do if you don't get a proper response. They cannot refuse because it will be 'detrimental to the fund'...they must consider the claim in accordance with the scheme rules, which no doubt will involve asking you to get a doctor to write to them about your medical state, and maybe also seeing a doctor of their choosing.

shelley17

Thanks quotememiserable, can they refuse the transfer though? I thought everyone had the right to transfer their pension fund.

If legally we don't have a leg to stand on with the transfer, then I believe we have to follow the grievance procedure initially with regards to ill health.

It's very difficult to understand how the trustees can act impartially given that they're the owners of the business and that after sacking my husband we had to take them to a tribunal. They won of course, on the grounds he couldn't do his job.
There's no way they'll allow anything that'll benefit my OH.

xylophone

http://www.pensions-ombudsman.org.uk/Complaints/Before_you_complain_to_us/index.aspx

atush

You need the ombudsman here. Go to the link above.

At least put a link to your old post? I read it, but not everyone will have.

shelley17

Thanks atush, yes ..sorry here's the link to my original thread
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4781977
Can we go straight to the ombudsman? I thought we had to follow the IDRP first, given that they trustees are also the directors?

Would be great if we can.

atush

have you written to them? have you filed a complaint?

Gotta do that first, but doesn't mean you cant call them or the pensions advisory service for advice in advance.

shelley17

atush wrote: »

have you written to them? have you filed a complaint?

Gotta do that first, but doesn't mean you cant call them or the pensions advisory service for advice in advance.

No haven't written to complain to trustees yet, wanted to see if legally they could refuse transfer first. I ll do that tomorrow, but I've emailed ombudsman to see if this complaint might be exempt from following the formal IDRP.
Thanks for your help, I can believe how stressful this has become.

atush

I'd call the pensions advisory service first for faster advice, you could be waiting weeks to hear the ombudman turn you down as you haven't followed the normal complaints procedure. that is if you get a a reply to email.

In legal matters like this, you need to put pen (or printer) to actual paper.

xylophone

According to link

"A few complaints are exempt from having to go through the IDRP. If you do not know if your scheme or your complaint is exempt, you should contact your pension scheme administrator who will confirm the position for you."

In view of the difficulties you have had, http://www.pensionsadvisoryservice.org.uk/when-things-go-wrong/internal-dispute-resolution-procedure

"You can ask us for help or advice at any time. But the Pensions Ombudsman can't consider a complaint against the scheme until you have gone through the IDRP process."

shelley17

xylophone wrote: »

According to link

"A few complaints are exempt from having to go through the IDRP. If you do not know if your scheme or your complaint is exempt, you should contact your pension scheme administrator who will confirm the position for you."

In view of the difficulties you have had, http://www.pensionsadvisoryservice.org.uk/when-things-go-wrong/internal-dispute-resolution-procedure

"You can ask us for help or advice at any time. But the Pensions Ombudsman can't consider a complaint against the scheme until you have gone through the IDRP process."

Years ago, it took me months of writing and chasing the trustees to get details of their IDRP. Eventually they wrote back and said 'any grievances you have should be made in writing to the trustees'

When I write to them, I assume I don't just state this is a grievance, I need to ask them to deal with the grievance using the IDRP?

Otherwise, months down the line, they'll suddenly say we didn't follow correct procedure and ask for IDRP to be used !

The thing is, they KNOW they can make this drag on for months and months, and the worst that will happen, is the ombudsman could possibly tell them to go ahead with the transfer !