Excel ignored PCN advice

LoveNorfolk

Thank you. I shall go through the said info in more detail when I have a moment. I have photos of my car in the space and other cars in surrounding spaces to prove I wasn't causing an obstruction as first stated. When I next pasd I am going to have a quick look if anyone is currently in that space and get a photo as I am 99% sure I have seen cars in it before. I will also take a photo of the signage for my records as that was one thing I forgot to do at the time and as far as I am aware they have not changed. I shall get any info needed together in case I should need it, cos this lady ain't a pushover. I'm quite happy to kerp fighting now I have this help and info.

bod1467

Redx wrote: »

neither does anybody else, which is why the sticky threads have them listed

Oi! That's MY signature! (Near enough)

Redx

no problem

the only other task is to try to identify the landowner or creditor, I think I mentioned this previously

the point here is the PPC have issued you a PCN for a reason on behalf of a landowner

so in theory the reason should be on the PCN or on the NTK, or on the other paperwork , so if its not obstruction then you cannot be held liable for obstruction

in theory its for TRESPASS, which again I must have mentioned earlier

your vehicle was parked on private land and supposedly this is in the control of a PPC to enforce no trepassing on that private land, hence the reason for the PCN in the first place

there may be some other reason on the PCN but its probably for trespass although it wont actually use that word itself

as I say , dont focus on what it isnt, focus on what it was, why it was , who says it was and why they are saying it

Redx

bod1467 wrote: »

Oi! That's MY signature!

lol

and a very good one it is too !!

it wouldnt let me use the live link but did let me use yours , thank you

I did remove the word IAN and insert newbies however

tried to amend it since but its having none of it if I try links

bod1467

You can't have links in signatures - no forum members can. (Admins/mods may be able to, but general users can't). That's why I did my sig that way.

LoveNorfolk

Redx wrote: »

no problem

the only other task is to try to identify the landowner or creditor, I think I mentioned this previously

the point here is the PPC have issued you a PCN for a reason on behalf of a landowner

so in theory the reason should be on the PCN or on the NTK, or on the other paperwork , so if its not obstruction then you cannot be held liable for obstruction

in theory its for TRESPASS, which again I must have mentioned earlier

your vehicle was parked on private land and supposedly this is in the control of a PPC to enforce no trepassing on that private land, hence the reason for the PCN in the first place

there may be some other reason on the PCN but its probably for trespass although it wont actually use that word itself

as I say , dont focus on what it isnt, focus on what it was, why it was , who says it was and why they are saying it

So it's a Parking Charge Notice. Box ticked was other then 'obstructive parking' written in space underneath. I am presuming they don't class where I parked as a space but as there were plenty of other spaces if it wasn't recognisable as a space I would've looked for another. That was Excel that says that. On later correspondance (Roxburghe, Graham White, Debt Recovery Plus)it was listed as 'Parking in a restricted area of the car park' as I have previously mentioned. But as far as I know there is nothing that states that that area is restricted and what areas are. There is another area of the car park which is gravelled wasteland with no bay markings. So if they class it as not a marked bay how do they go on with the unmarked ones?

I would not know where to start in finding who the landowner/creditor is.

Redx

those are exactly the points you could have raised in the past and can raise if you get an LBA or LBCCC as you would require proof of adequate signage , no marked bays, who the landowner is, proof by maps of the boundaries of the private site , does the person representing the PPC in court have the right to prosecute , what losses did the landowner incur (a genuine pre-estimate of costs) due to your vehicle being there etc etc

all these kinds of questions are your defence, as would be the change in wording between the original PCN and the subsequent letters (the so called contravention charge)

LoveNorfolk

Thanks. I have had a little look round on the internet but cannot find anything at the mo saying who owns the land. I can also get a screen shot of google maps of the car park and boundary fence the car was parked against. It's not fantastically clear, but would help a little show no traffic could get through even if I wasn't there. I cannot see how they have lost any income as there were plenty of spaces, the row behind was full when we left the car park and the same cars were there when we returned. I could understand it if I was stopping people entering the car park and preventing 'customers' from entering and paying. How £2.50 ticket can turn into £149 'charge' is ridiculous! Annoying thing is ticket was valid for like 11 hours and I was only there 2/3!

Redx

LoveNorfolk wrote: »

Thanks. I have had a little look round on the internet but cannot find anything at the mo saying who owns the land. I can also get a screen shot of google maps of the car park and boundary fence the car was parked against. It's not fantastically clear, but would help a little show no traffic could get through even if I wasn't there. I cannot see how they have lost any income as there were plenty of spaces, the row behind was full when wenleft the car park and the same cars were there when we returned. How £2.50 ticket can turn into £149 'charge' is ridiculous!

agreed, and you would have won at POPLA, but its too late for that now

can you say if the £2.50p was paid or not ?

if it was paid, do you still have that ticket ?

if yes to the above then the landowner has made no loss but as the parking charge alleges obstruction its clear that you need to prove no obstruction was caused by having timed and dated photos of the actual place you parked and others who may have parked in the same place since, showing it both empty and full (the actual parking place, not the car park - even if the car park was empty its still possible to obstruct it if you park in the wrong place)

the £2.50 turns into a large charge due to the unreasonable demands of the greedy PPC,s , who issue blanket "fines" or punishments instead of calculating a reasonable amount based on the landowners losses and any paperwork sorting it out , like DVLA etc

clearly you could have demonstrated this in a POPLA appeal, so can still do so if it goes to court

the more you get the judge on your side, with good rebuttals and evidence and questions of authority of the PPC in taking court action etc , the better

LoveNorfolk

Yes I paid £2.50 and had a valid ticket stuck to my windscreen. I still have that original ticket, I have kept everything I have received including envelopes from everyone. I have photographs of the car in the space from every angle and will be returning at some point to photograph signage (I was parked next to one), I did get one in a photo but not clear enough to read it properly and also to see if anyone else if parked in that space and then photograph it either way. The fence the car was parked against slices the original car park in half and cuts across some spaces and also makes some close to where the car was parked impossible to enter and therefore manoueve out where the car was - even if it hadn't been!