Vet thinks pup is 'dominant'

catkins

neveranymoney wrote: »

Other things I forgot to add;

If anyone reading this is single, borrow a puppy for a few hours, they are babe magnets. No wonder my husband takes her to meet me....

This made me laugh. My husband has always said the same. We actually met through dogs. He was walking his dogs and I stopped to stroke the dogs, we got talking and over 30 years later we are still together!

When we moved to where we live now we knew no one except my sister and brother in law. We met so many people through our dog.

neveranymoney

I'm the same, this isn't my side of town and it has taken a long time to feel settled here. When we had scampers and went to the glens and 'fens and spinnys' as we call them, we were forever talking to people and well, shadow is a gallery player and you can't move without nice people stopping for a natter.

The internet is a funny thing, I just imagined catkins that you were around my age (mid thirties) and a stay at home mum too. Does anyone else mentally imagine what other people they communicate with on line are like in real life? Maybe it's just me!

catkins

neveranymoney wrote: »

I'm the same, this isn't my side of town and it has taken a long time to feel settled here. When we had scampers and went to the glens and 'fens and spinnys' as we call them, we were forever talking to people and well, shadow is a gallery player and you can't move without nice people stopping for a natter.

The internet is a funny thing, I just imagined catkins that you were around my age (mid thirties) and a stay at home mum too. Does anyone else mentally imagine what other people they communicate with on line are like in real life? Maybe it's just me!

No, I am late 50's and have no children but I am kind of flattered that you thought I was your age.

I too have mental pictures of some of the regular posters on here but I am sure I am probably very wrong in my ideas

neveranymoney

I think I haven't mentally progressed past 25, but really I have. My ideal Saturday night is a roaring fire and good telly, with everyone in and safe.

The first someone called me 'Mrs' I actually turned round to see what grown up they were so obviously referring to. I'll admit I'm not thrilled when people in shops refer to me as a lady however, I'm still a girl, can't they see that??

neveranymoney

Feeling horrible, really roared at Shadow as she was trying to ingest my daughters hand and I put her out in the hall for 10 seconds after repeatedly going back in for a second, third and fourth go at anything she could get her chops around. She gave me the evils when I brought her back in and made friends. Then my son was all upset she was told off. Now conked out in front of the fire she 'helped' set.

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Wellyboots6

The getting on the sofa thing sounds familiar!

When I first got LS he was not going to be allowed upstairs, but he could jump the baby gate.
Then he was allowed upstairs but not in the bedroom. He could open the bedroom door.
Then he was allowed where he likes upstairs, but not on the furniture. He could jump on the furniture when I wasn't looking.
Then he was allowed on the sofa, but only when invited. He would jump on and take up all the room before I had chance to sit down.
Then he was allowed on the sofa, but had to get off when told...

I now sit on the floor!!

To be fair to him though, he does get off when told even if he does complain about it. It is so nice to have a snuggly dog to warm me up though, and very MSE as I don't have to put the heating on!

I don't know what it is about him, as my previous dog was not allowed upstairs or on the furniture and never even tried. Having had LS taking a few more liberties, I do now wish my previous dog had been allowed a bit more leeway.

meritaten

katy721 wrote: »

The getting on the sofa thing sounds familiar!

When I first got LS he was not going to be allowed upstairs, but he could jump the baby gate.
Then he was allowed upstairs but not in the bedroom. He could open the bedroom door.
Then he was allowed where he likes upstairs, but not on the furniture. He could jump on the furniture when I wasn't looking.
Then he was allowed on the sofa, but only when invited. He would jump on and take up all the room before I had chance to sit down.
Then he was allowed on the sofa, but had to get off when told...

I now sit on the floor!!

To be fair to him though, he does get off when told even if he does complain about it. It is so nice to have a snuggly dog to warm me up though, and very MSE as I don't have to put the heating on!

I don't know what it is about him, as my previous dog was not allowed upstairs or on the furniture and never even tried. Having had LS taking a few more liberties, I do now wish my previous dog had been allowed a bit more leeway.

My word! He IS training you well!:)

neveranymoney

Katy, your exploits alway amuse me, you've the heart of a lion!

Scampers was crazy about the settee, but always moved or got down and was quite polite about it all but I don't think he was previously allowed up the stairs and was always 'funny' about it. He came up very quietly and was nervous and sometimes just sat in the hall.

Well, dolly here had a tremendously exhausting evening, she's always uppity after tea time until bed. Charged about trailing various toys, blankets around in her gob, tried to murder them for a while, had a teeny bit of training, generally horsed about and tried to separate our clothes and hands from our bodies, had a 3 second cry to get up on the settee, unfortunately I was trying to watch the very end of dr who at this point and having to wait for one more second was obviously a step too far for her so she took off to bed in a strunt - she actually thumped herself down in disgust.

Now ensconced beside me, she's getting too big to be lifted confortably for her now. Every time she has a doze and gets up at least one of us exclaim, 'SHES GROWN AGAIN IN HER SLEEP!'

JencParker

neveranymoney wrote: »

As the title says, what I was basically told this morning!

Miss Shadow had her final jab this morning and the vet was a lovely young girl, (how you know you aren't in the first flush of youth, professional people look like mere infants) and when she was asking me general questions I told her a few bits and bobs.

So I'm guessing she's around 10 weeks old? She is a puppy so 'dominance' would not even come into the equation even if it were an issue.

The nipping and biting aren't JUST as bad, but she has started humping legs. Never my husbands, she has a try at mine but goes nuts on my daughter. My daughter is almost 15 and very animal orientated and knows how to deal with it, but more often than not, she will ignore her commands. It is dealt with by me or hubby saying 'Shadow, Off' this usually works but if she is in funny half hour, she will start again.

Humping is caused by a number of things, most often excitement, and certainly not dominance until the hormones start kicking in.

My son is a bit scared of her and I think she knows this, she really goes to town on his slippers or trouser legs and he keeps out of her way tbh, however I do encourage play and cuddles when appropriate.

Encourage play and get him involved in some positive training (teaching sit, down etc), but being tactile and cuddling isn't a canine behaviour - the sort of 'play' you describe (chewing and biting trouser legs etc is). Yes, dogs can become cuddle monsters but this is a learned behaviour not a natural one and your puppy is very new to the world and hasn't learnt it yet.

Shadow is a mardy miss, she's not particularly pettish, althought she is coming round to it and will lie on my knee, but doesn't mind taking herself off, quite inexplicably to a bed in the kitchen, she can take or leave her snuggly crate which is in the living room with us!

As above

Any road up, the vet basically said these were signs of dominance, I wasn't to let her up the stairs or the settee anymore, we were to exit and enter before her, the usual dominance stuff. You could have blown me over with a feather.

Does your vet specialise in canine behaviour? I doubt it. Ignore the dominance comments it is still a commonly held belief in spite of plenty of evidence to the contrary.

I thought all that dominance stuff was debunked?? After working with scampers so intensively, a blind man could see that that sort of stuff would have had a complete adverse effect, although to be fair, Shadow is a different kettle of fish entirely and is, shall we say, rather confident - excellent at maintaining eye contact and ready for a training session 24/7.

I have to be honest and say that she is definitely more respectful of my husband, for want of a better phrase but I certainly don't want to stop letting her up on the settee, one of the loveliest bits of pet ownership is having a warm, doggy smelling thing lying on you, but it was the way the vet said it.

While I'm on my little rant, am I right to be absolutely fed up and ignoring the never ending stream of naysayers telling me to tap her on the nose, or roll up a piece of newspaper and 'tap' her with that?? (Apparently 'they' don't like the noise was another gem. I wily shave thought getting hit would have been the unpleasant part!)

I have basically taken the long route to say, I'm not a believer in the dominance theory - that she has to be seen as the bottom of the pack but she is not lacking in confidence, or displays any sign of 'submisssion' so do I heed the vets advice about the settee and what have you?

The kennel club puppy classes are completely full until at least the new year, so I am waiting to hear when the classes run in the vets (but by a trainer, not the vets) have the numbers to start sessions. I don't feel I need the behaviourist as yet and she she very easily trained. She's a lab after all and would sell her little soul for any morsel of food.

Shadow makes us think of the scampers boy everyday, my daughter still wears his tags around her neck and she actually helped me see that this was not the right atmosphere for such a nervous wee thing, silly things like having a disco dance with my son don't even raise an eyelid with her, well, she may want to join in but we couldn't do anything like that with scampers about although I did have a wee cry about him and secretly wished for just one hour of the peace he brought when he was a happy chap.

Apologies for rambling, it's that sort of a day!

Your puppy is a blank canvas and doesn't yet know how to live with a different species. She's a lab so very biddable. Teach her the things you DO want with positive reinforcement and ignore (or redirect) those behaviours you don't.

She sounds like a typical lovely but exhausting puppy and ignore all the comments. It never ceases to amaze me how everyone tends to be an expert when it comes to dogs .

JencParker

neveranymoney wrote: »

My last dog was a rescue and had quite severe fear induced dog aggression, bit another dog quite badly and we had the most wonderful behaviourist and were working through that. He was not used to children at all and whilst he made great progress in many things, he bared his teeth and moved into my face, behaviourist felt that this could not go on in light of having children in the house. It is a very sad subject and moonlight shadow is our new doggy companion, the house was too quiet.

We are quite firm, on one of her particularly mad moments of biting, humping etc I intervened with a very loud OFF and NO and gave her what my mother would have called 'the bad eye' and the removed all ourselves from her. She stopped but couldn't have given a toss really.

Due to scampers/behaviourist I can sort of see body language stuff that I wouldn't have seen before and I agree, she definitely needs a firm reminder but (I didn't tell vet this bit, lord knows what she would have made of this) when I brought her up to see my daughter in bed, she really didn't want me to take her away again and barked and got on a bit, not in a playful way.

I know for a fact the behaviourist would wet himself about the dominance stuff, with scampers he said it was grand to be on the settee as long as they were invited up, ie, asked to sit or something before they got up. Obviously shadow is a pup and can't make it up with out being lifted but that is not for the want of trying, I would say she will make it herself in the next few weeks and I have to say, I think trouble will start then!

I have a lot if stuff the behaviourist gave me about training a puppy as we were going back to basics with scampers but I need to save to get shadow neutered and I have the gas and electric bill in at the end of this month but the behaviourist is so positive and reassuring, I would like a visit....

Apologies for picking out quotes, but it is easier to answer this way. Dogs do what work for them. She wanted to be with your daughter and didn't understand she had to come with you. While training, you want to make the outcome more positive, not force the issue. If she didn't want to come, rather than make her, be positive, encouraging, even use a treat to get her to come to you - much better than trying to force the issue which is teaching her nothing except to confuse her.