Who's fault?

drdog_2

I was driven into this evening - who is at fault?

The circumstances:
7.20pm I was some 300m from traffic lights where I would make a left turn. Leading up to the lights there are two lanes of traffic. At the lights the left lane is for left turns only. From about 390m before the lights to about 65m before the lights the left lane is a bus lane that operates from 7.30am to 10am.
I intended to make a left turn at the lights.
In the right lane there was a queue of stationary traffic that would be either turning right before the lights or heading straight on at the traffic lights - though some people do not realise that the bus lane only operates in the morning and join the left turn lane at the end of the bus lane outside of times the bus lane operates.
I was driving along the left lane, not indicating as I was some 300m from the left turn I intended to make and there is a turning into a carpark before the traffic lights.
On the nearside in the direction I was travelling, is an entrance to a petrol station. It was at this enterance that I was driven into.
At the point I was hit there must have been a short gap [2 cars at most] in the stationary traffic (or start stop moving) to my right opposite the enterance to the petrol station.
A car coming in the opposite direction turned right, across the traffic, through this short gap as I was passing the gap. That car would be on the offside of the startionary traffic, I was on the nearside.
The car turning accross the lanes of traffic hit me on my offside - the damage is restricted to the offside of my car, possibly to the front wing, but mainly to the drivers door and possibly to the rear offside door. the drivers door is unopenable and the sill is probably damaged. At the point of impact I would have been doing between 20 and 30 miles an hour - I image nearer 20. I was alarmed at how much the impact of the other car pushed my car left - I'm not sure how fast it was going when it hit me - but my gut feeling would be that they had seen the gap and quickly turned into the petrol station. I was hidden from them by the stationary cars.
There is no damage to the front of my car only to the side. The damage to the other car was restricted to the front offside corner.
So who is liable?

scheming_gypsy

If they turned right to go into the petrol station and drove into the side of a car because the road wasn't clear.. then it's their fault

DUTR

There is a lot of waffle there, it doesn't matter what the internet concensous is, let the insurance companies battle it out, if neither of you are going to admit liability.

Ultrasonic

I'm not an expert, but it sounds like the other driver is at fault to me. They turned right across a road without checking that the way was clear.

Ultimately it will up to your respective insurance companies to argue over though.

Edit: I don't suppose the fuel station has any CCTV footage of the accident?

drdog_2

I have been driven into before - on that occasion and this I never challenged the driver about liability. As I understand it, insurance companies advise that you should not admitt liablilty. And in the heat of the moment it may not be advisable to challenge people - if they realise they are resonsible I guess they may not want to admit it, so challenging them may have adverse effects

DUTR

drdog wrote: »

I have been driven into before - on that occasion and this I never challenged the driver about liability. As I understand it, insurance companies advise that you should not admitt liablilty. And in the heat of the moment it may not be advisable to challenge people - if they realise they are resonsible I guess they may not want to admit it, so challenging them may have adverse effects

Was you in a Focus?
Although you have described the situation, it's not so straight forward, even if someone runs up the rear of another, with the growing staged accident scenario's the insurance companies are investigating :eek:
Let them decide and argue which party is liable.

mad_rich

From what you have described, 100% the other guy's fault. Whether you can prove it is another question. Draw a sketch of the situation now to remind you how it happened.

I'm very cautious when I'm using the bus lane (aka "mad_rich's Personal Lane") like that. The 80% of drivers who don't realise that they can (should) be in lane 1 are prone to doing unexpected things.

BertTheRaccoon

Your car does not drive sideways, therefore the other person has collided with you.

So long as you are legitimately allowed to use the bus lane where you did at that time, then I can't see that you should have to accept any contributory negligence here. You could be criticised for speed i.e. you are aware there are junctions and petrol station exits and that traffic may want to turn in, so should have been driving at an appropriate speed to be able to stop if a hazard was encountered.

But I still doubt you should get clobbered for anything here given the area of damage.

It you were a bus that was hit in the side, you would ague "what has the bus done wrong" - same rules apply - where is the negligence/ breach of duty of care on your behalf here?

Expecting there could be arguments about your use of the bus lane, it is worth getting pics of the location and the signs confirming you can use the bus lane at the time you were using it.

DUTR

BertTheRaccoon wrote: »

Your car does not drive sideways, therefore the other person has collided with you.

So long as you are legitimately allowed to use the bus lane where you did at that time, then I can't see that you should have to accept any contributory negligence here. You could be criticised for speed i.e. you are aware there are junctions and petrol station exits and that traffic may want to turn in, so should have been driving at an appropriate speed to be able to stop if a hazard was encountered.

But I still doubt you should get clobbered for anything here given the area of damage.

It you were a bus that was hit in the side, you would ague "what has the bus done wrong" - same rules apply - where is the negligence/ breach of duty of care on your behalf here?

Expecting there could be arguments about your use of the bus lane, it is worth getting pics of the location and the signs confirming you can use the bus lane at the time you were using it.

Ordinarily that would be correct, however like in the pic below, I was in the lane where the Micra is and there was a Corsa where the taxi on the right is, the Corsa was proceeding straight ahead and had stopped and flashed to let me out onto the main road, there was nothing ahead or behind him, my instincts told me not to accept the offer to join the main road, as I suspect the driver would simply drive into the side of my vehicle and claim I pulled into the main carriageway and into his path



That is one of the reasons I posted let the insurance companies decide , as if the OP is in a left hand lane turning left and a car in the opposite direction is turning right, then why has it taken so long for the OP to complete the manouvre? He already has the advantage of being closer to the junction, so should be clear of the junction before the opposing car had reached the junction OR the opposing vehicle was already completing the right hand turn and the OP had entered the opposing vehicle's path, it is no longer so clear cut.
I don't recall the OP replying to whether he was in the Focus that was assumed beyond economical repair last year?

BertTheRaccoon

I think you have misunderstood the accident circumstances/ road layout.

My understanding is it was a straight section of road, OP proceeding in the left lane, solid queue of traffic in right lane. Gap in traffic in right hand lane and oncoming third party turns right and goes through the gap and drives into the driver side of OP's vehicle.

My understanding is that the collision took place some distance back from the junction where the OP was intending to eventually turn left.

scheming_gypsy

From his description the scenario was totally different. When you strip away all the waffley detail about junctions and distance, I think the basic jist of it was:
" i was driving down the street and as I passed a petrol station on my left, a car coming the opposite direction turned right into the petrol station, crashing into my drivers side"