CP+ and Railway Byelaws

Coupon-mad

It seems odd that CPPlus have '35 days to reply' (which is the BPA CoP deadline for PRIVATE parking charges) and yet they are pretending this one isn't 'private' but a real penalty. I would not fold and after all you need to wait and see what rubbish response you get. I wonder what the TOC will say, if anything?

Puddings

Thanks very much, both, I'll sit tight and see what happens!

Thanks again for everyone's help x

Puddings

I have my first letter from Debt Recovery Plus.

It's a demand for £120 that they want by 27th February.

If I don't pay they will consider taking Court action.

Penalty notice issued under Section 19 of the Transport Act. Under the terms of this act, if you fail to pay the penalty and park on railway land managed by our client your vehicle may be clamped, removed and stored until the outstanding penalty and any costs incurred are paid. Alternatively or client may seek to take Court action for recovery of the penalty plus Court costs.

That's reminded me I've not heard from the TOC so I'll chase that tomorrow, I've tried PF but they day I have to do as CP+ tell me but I'll contact them again to re lack of response from SWT.

Anything else I should do? I'm not parking at the train station now but what if I Park somewhere else run by CP without realising!

Puds x

Coupon-mad

Of course you know you can ignore DRP letters as these are fully covered in the sticky threads, as trash.

what if I Park somewhere else run by CP without realising!

Well you seem to have missed the fact that clamping and towing on other private land is a crime, illegal. Banned under the POFA 2012. Railways can be different but this is a moot point. Anyway, CPPlus are being unreasonable and using an unregulated debt collector which is hardly part of any REAL 'penalty charge' normal process. But I have just edited this reply to suggest you keep quiet right now.

What was the date of the original charge? It's just that the TOC only has six months in total to 'lay a penalty before the courts' and you must be close to that next month! So I would hold your breath and cross off the days, knowing all the time that you are getting DRP letters then it sure as heck isn't moving towards Mag's court!

HO87

@OP. Presumably the reference to s.19 Transport Act 2000 came from the DR+ letter? Nice to see that they continue to spout utter rubbish as s.19 relates to the modification of CAA licences and has nothing whatsoever to do with the railways. Poor research on their part, once again, as I suspect they are actually referring to s.219 which was the enabling provision for the establishment of railway byelaws.

The penalty referred to is actually in relation to offences in Byelaw 14 - of which there are four. You had not contravened a parking sign(14(1)) and nor had you parked and failed to pay the appropriate fee(14(3)). The only offence they could pursue you for is contrary to byelaw 14(2) - parking so as to cause obstruction or hindrance (14(2)(i))or otherwise than as directed (14(2)(ii)). However, there is absolutely no provision whatsoever for the imposition of a penalty charge in respect of either of these offences (see byelaw 14(4)(i)) - only alleged breaches of byelaw 14(1) or 14(3) may attract those penalties and in each case only the owner is liable to pay them.

It would therefore seem that CP+ and the TOC - as they are working on behalf of them (presumably) are acting beyond the law in seeking to impose a penalty for which there is no legal provision. That said, as you may already have seen on pepipoo, it would not be the first time that a TOC has commenced proceedings in the Magistrates Court on exactly the same basis.

As Coupon-Mad has said the Train Operating Company (not CP+) has only 6 calendar months (from the day after the alleged offence) to "lay an information" (apply for a Magistrates Court summons). You posted at the end of October so there could well be another two months to go. (October to November = 1 month, November to December = 2 months, December to January = 3 months and January to February = 4 months) You might just want to check on the dates.

Puddings

Thank you so much to both of you.

Apologies HO87, my typo, they have written section 219, posting on my phone last night and didn't check properly.

Thank you for the info on the byelaws and the penalties, very interesting.

The date of the 'offence' was 15th October so I have until 16th April to wait.

They wanted payment by the 27th but I only received the notice on the 27th - well that's hardly a reasonable amount of time! The letter is dated 13th Feb. No date on the envelope.

So, for now, I'll just sit tight...and have another read of this forum and pepipoo!

Puddings

Hi all,

Recieved a further letter yesterday from Debt Recovery Plus offering a reduced payment.

So, they referred the case to 'the creditor with the recommendation that they appoint their solicitor to commence court proceedings against you'.

It goes on to say:

In order to comply with all aspects of 'pre-action protocol' and to demonstrate to the courts their attempts to settle this matter before the need for court proceedings, our client is prepared to accept a reduced payment of £96.00 in full and final settlement.

This is our clients final offer before they pass the case to their solicitor.

If you do not pay the reduced amount by 31/03/2014, of if you have not agreed a payment option with us by then, the amount due will go back to the full amount of £120 and the matter will be referred to the creditor's solicitor to consider court proceedings.

Please note that, if the court orders you to pay the penalty notice, we will seek to recover the following amounts from you as well as the penalty:
- court fee £30
- Solicitor's costs £50
- Interets of 8% per annum

A court judgement could seriously affect your ability to obtain credit in the future.

When I was at the train station this week I noticed that they have nbow placed their building materials in the exact place that I parked so I can't have been doing anything dangerous!

After the payment date of 31/03/14 has passed I have 16 days to wait for the 6 calendar months to have passed.

It just says 'court proceedings' not magistrates court..

Still sitting tight and another big thank you to you all. I'm an avid reader :-)

Puds x

Coupon-mad

I am toying with the thought that, on 30th March you could send a letter to engage DRP in some pointless correspondence asking them to explain something like the 'payment options' that they alluded to in their recent letter. Something very basic, asking for more information. NOTHING about the byelaws or TOC - something very general about DRP for them to reply to, then you can reply again...ensuring it stays in the DRP in-trays in their excitement at thinking someone is thinking about payment options, and in discussing that, the case won't be referred back.

Puddings

I like your way of thinking CM. I'll do this to drag out the time :-)

I'll let you know what happens!

Z10

I have had a similar situation.

They have asked me for 140 but now have said 114 by end of month.

Jokers.