UKPC Parking Invoice - Belfast

TOMTHEHATCHET

So, one of these dreadful, disgusting, horrible little notices was put on my car on Saturday afternoon in a "free" retail car park on the Boucher Road in Belfast. There was about 10-15 cars with the same little notice so they were obviously on a mission to make a few quid on Saturday. £100 charge reduced to £60 if paid in 14 days.

Let me say from the outset I am angry beyond belief about these cowboys and I have a very very militant attitude towards it. I AM NOT GOING TO PAY THEM ANYTHING UNLESS A COURT DECIDES OTHERWISE! Sorry about the shouting but I have been told that representatives of these cowboys read the forums so just wanted them to get the message loud and clear from the start!

Luckily, I have a financial services background so they can't mess with my head in terms of threatening me with my credit file etc ie I know how far I can take it before it will have any affect(which is all the way to court if needed). If a court decides I should pay I'll pay. This isn't a question about the money but the dam principle of the matter.

I have been in this car park a gazillion times. I have read their many signs they have up numerous times and have never ever read on them that "if you leave this site you are liable to a parking charge"!

I drove up to the car park last night to take pictures as I was absolutely convinced that I had not seen that on their signs before. By the way I am not saying I was driving on Saturday.

Anyways took a couple of pictures and yes in nice shiny yellow writing it does now say "if you leave this site whilst this vehicle remains you will be liable to a parking charge" On closer inspection of the sign(picture attached) the nice shiny yellow is clearly a sticker that has been put over whatever the original information is i.e the car park has changed it's terms and conditions. I am 110% convinced that this is a very recent change as I remember looking at the same signs less than 2 months ago and it did not say anything about leaving the site. This is my first issue. Surely if the car park has changed it's terms and conditions and it is claiming that you enter a contract with it when you drive into it then surely it should have in big writing at the car park entrance that the "Terms and Conditions of entry to this Car Park have changed"?

My second issue is they say on their invoice that they first noticed that the driver had left the site at 15.11. Without saying too much on a public forum this is a physical impossibility and could be backed up by evidence by literally dozens of people. Again I am not saying the driver didn't leave the site but I am saying it was impossible for them to have noticed it at 15.11.

My third issue is this is a free car park that had literally dozens of empty spaces so what "loss" has UKPC or the car parks owners incurred?

My 4th issue is they have posted photographic evidence on their website which supposedly shows the driver leaving the site. The 4 pictures are all of my car parked in a bay with empty spaces all around. How is that evidence that the driver left the site?

Basically, I am looking a bit of advice as all the advice on here(which is brilliant and plentiful) seems to mainly focus on England and Wales. What is the position in Northern Ireland? I know we don't have an independent appeals process.

Should I just ignore it and see if they want to pursue it in court down the line or should I tackle them head on from day 1? I am happy to do either.

Should I use their online appeal or wait for them to get my details from the DVLA? By the way under what law in Northern Ireland are they allowed to get my details from the DVLA and how is the DVLA disclosing my details not breaching the Data Protection Act when I have not committed any criminal offence?

Has any other forum members in Northern Ireland been invoiced by these cowboys and refused to pay? If so what happened?

As I said at the start I have a real bee in my bonnet over this and intend to push this as far as they want it to go. I'd really appreciate anyones advice and opinions.

martmonk

There is no registered keeper liability in Northern Ireland. They don't know who was driving unless you tell them so therefore ignore.

zzzLazyDaisy

TOMTHEHATCHET wrote: »

Basically, I am looking a bit of advice as all the advice on here(which is brilliant and plentiful) seems to mainly focus on England and Wales. What is the position in Northern Ireland? I know we don't have an independent appeals process.

Put Scotland in the search box - the law and advice is the same for NI

Should I just ignore it and see if they want to pursue it in court down the line or should I tackle them head on from day 1? I am happy to do either.

Ignore

Should I use their online appeal or wait for them to get my details from the DVLA?

Ignore - do not contact them in any way - your mouth and your pen are your own worst enemies!

The legal position is the POFA 2012 does not apply in NI, so the parking company can only pursue the driver. Yes they can obtain RK details from DVLA (providing they are a member of BPA) but that only enables them to write nasty letters to the RK. The RK has NO legal liability for the parking charge and they cannot take the RK to court. The RK also has no obligation to reply to their letters , and importantly no matter what they try to tell you, the RK has no obligation to identify the driver.

However, there are proposals to introduce a similar arrangement in NI, so if this happens again do not assume the advice will be the same - come back and check.

Daisy

TOMTHEHATCHET

martmonk wrote: »

There is no registered keeper liability in Northern Ireland. They don't know who was driving unless you tell them so therefore ignore.

Does this mean there is no way for them to obtain my details?

martmonk

TOMTHEHATCHET wrote: »

Does this mean there is no way for them to obtain my details?

I wouldn't even attempt to explain it better than Daisy ^^^^^^

zappahey

TOMTHEHATCHET wrote: »

Does this mean there is no way for them to obtain my details?

Are you the Registered Keeper? In that case, they can get your details.

Coupon-mad

zappahey wrote: »

Are you the Registered Keeper? In that case, they can get your details.

Yes, a PPC can get DVLA data of the registered keeper if they are an AOS member. But they can't get the DRIVER's details unless a person is daft enough to give them that!!

But in Scotland and NI, the keeper should ignore because the information given by Tim Cary, the Solicitor on Watchdog, still applies there:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAIcdi9niHA

So ignore, ignore, ignore. NO APPEAL is available but nothing happens except junk mail from debt collectors like we have all had and ignored ourselves in the past.

zappahey

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Yes, a PPC can get DVLA data of the registered keeper if they are an AOS member. But they can't get the DRIVER's details unless a person is daft enough to give them that!!

But in Scotland and NI, the keeper should ignore because the information given by Tim Cary, the Solicitor on Watchdog, still applies there:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAIcdi9niHA

So ignore, ignore, ignore. NO APPEAL is available but nothing happens except junk mail from debt collectors like we have all had and ignored ourselves in the past.

Yes, I know that, but the OP seemed to have comprehension challenges so thought I would make it crystal clear that the RK can be identified.

Though, to be honest, martmonk was spot on, that Daisy's post was already completely clear, and I probably shouldn't have bothered.

TOMTHEHATCHET

zappahey wrote: »

Yes, I know that, but the OP seemed to have comprehension challenges so thought I would make it crystal clear that the RK can be identified.

Though, to be honest, martmonk was spot on, that Daisy's post was already completely clear, and I probably shouldn't have bothered.

Oi cheeky:p I posted my question re DVLA before I had seen daisys fantastic reply:money:

SevenTowers

TOMTHEHATCHET wrote: »

Has any other forum members in Northern Ireland been invoiced by these cowboys and refused to pay? If so what happened?

Yup - I got a piece of litter stuck on my windscreen by UKPC at Yorkgate in January 2013.

What happened? I received some junk mail for 3 months and then - absolutely nothing


UKPC have never taken anybody to court, anywhere in the UK, and you can be sure that they aren't going to start in NI. According to our Minister responsible, no PPC has ever taken a court claim in NI.

DO NOT waste your time contacting UKPC, let them spend their money obtaining your details from Coleraine and sending you junk mail and ignore, ignore and then ignore some more.

If you're interested in Stormont's views on PPCs in NI check out my last post. I can't post a link but just click on my name and also check out Pepipoo.

SevenTowers

TOMTHEHATCHET wrote: »

Oi cheeky:p I posted my question re DVLA before I had seen daisys fantastic reply:money:

I think that was supposed to be Comprehensive Challenges, not a jibe at you, oh what a difference 2 letters can make!