Home cake business

notanewuser

hayley11 wrote: »

No it's not. Not if you value your time, charge for all ingredients, electricity etc. Believe me, that is based on real costings, that I use for my business.

Are you charging for your time while the cake is in the oven, or sitting cooling? It doesn't take me much more than 10 minutes to weigh out ingredients and get a cake mix into Tina. When it's in the oven I'm doing other things. 2 minutes max to get them out and set them on cooling racks, and another 5 to get them out of the tins and wrapped up ready to decorate.

How much are you valuing your time, exactly?!

hayley11

notanewuser wrote: »

Are you charging for your time while the cake is in the oven, or sitting cooling? It doesn't take me much more than 10 minutes to weigh out ingredients and get a cake mix into Tina. When it's in the oven I'm doing other things. 2 minutes max to get them out and set them on cooling racks, and another 5 to get them out of the tins and wrapped up ready to decorate.

How much are you valuing your time, exactly?!

10 minutes to get cake in the oven....wow, what type of cake is that? I make a madeira most of the time as it's strong and will hold the icing and decorations well. It takes me about 30 minutes easy to weigh everything out and get the cake in the oven, longer if it's a bigger cake.

But then I mix the butter and sugar for a good 10 minutes on it's own to ensure it's very light, then mixing the eggs, flour etc. These all take time to ensure a light and fluffy cake. I could just throw everything into the mixer and be done with it but then my cake wouldn't be very nice. An 8" cake then takes two hours to bake, while that's baking, i'll do the washing up and clean down the kitchen, that takes maybe another 30 minutes to do a thorough job. I don't include the other 90 minutes in my costing at my full hourly rate but I do charge for these, I am using electricity afterall.

LE3

earthstorm wrote: »

simple victoria sponge for ingredients only at asda prices

4oz/100g self-raising flour - 500G Bero 78p
4oz/100g sugar (normal should be fine) - 1KG granulated 88p or 1KG Castor £1.48
4oz/100g butter - 250G £1.90
2 eggs - 6 eggs £1

£4.56 or £5.16

so by the time you add electricity/gas and your time then it will be approx. £12

You've quoted there for full packets of the ingredients not just what you will actually use! Even buying 500g Bero flour (instead of the more economical 1.5Kg bags), that's only 15p for the flour, 15p for the sugar, 75p for the butter (though you can get butter MUCH cheaper than that!) and 34p for the eggs
so only £1.40 for your ingredients, and that would make more than a single 6" square cake! - maybe if you were doing 2 deep layers, but we were talking about 1" cubes, so that's only one layer of cake ...

It's all academic anyway - we aren't talking about pricing a 6" cake to sell, we are talking about pricing a 6" cake for samples! If you were making cakes as samples surely you'd bake them when you were making other cakes, or perhaps wouldn't charge the full amount for your time if it were to help build your business!

earthstorm

LE3 wrote: »

You've quoted there for full packets of the ingredients not just what you will actually use! Even buying 500g Bero flour (instead of the more economical 1.5Kg bags), that's only 15p for the flour, 15p for the sugar, 75p for the butter (though you can get butter MUCH cheaper than that!) and 34p for the eggs
so only £1.40 for your ingredients, and that would make more than a single 6" square cake! - maybe if you were doing 2 deep layers, but we were talking about 1" cubes, so that's only one layer of cake ...

i priced on the good butter, but then when can you go into a store and ask for 100G flour or 2 eggs, so you need to price as full packs as that's what you have to purchase, but for samples you would be better off making cupcakes for the samples

LE3

I could get a victoria sponge or madeira in the oven in <15 mins!
Do you do your 10 minutes mixing the butter & sugar by hand, or is it in a machine? If in the machine, then surely you are doing other things in that time not just watching it!
If you are making an 8" madeira cake, it doesn't take 2 hours to bake - 40-50 mins sounds about right! (see as an example the 7" here http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/madeiracake_73878)

I'm glad that you have a successful business that allows you to cost your cakes out to allow for 2hrs time AND full bags of ingredients for each cake - I am always willing to pay for good workmanship & will pay for expertise but I guess I would find your prices too high!

LE3

earthstorm wrote: »

i priced on the good butter, but then when can you go into a store and ask for 100G flour or 2 eggs, so you need to price as full packs as that's what you have to purchase, but for samples you would be better off making cupcakes for the samples

:rotfl:

you know, having thought about it I'm liking your logic now ... I'd like to buy your second cake please

I mean, you won't need to buy any ingredients because you already have them paid for by the customer of the £12 cake 1, my cake can go in the oven when cake #1 is baking so I figure I owe you what, 30 mins of time max? At £7 an hour, that's £3.50. Result!

The OP seems to have disappeared & this thread has turned into a ridiculous.

earthstorm

LE3 wrote: »

The OP seems to have disappeared

No shes still waiting on the street corner for a customer that was coming to collect a cake last week. :rotfl:

hayley11

LE3 wrote: »

I could get a victoria sponge or madeira in the oven in <15 mins!
Do you do your 10 minutes mixing the butter & sugar by hand, or is it in a machine? If in the machine, then surely you are doing other things in that time not just watching it!
If you are making an 8" madeira cake, it doesn't take 2 hours to bake - 40-50 mins sounds about right! (see as an example the 7" here http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/madeiracake_73878)

I'm glad that you have a successful business that allows you to cost your cakes out to allow for 2hrs time AND full bags of ingredients for each cake - I am always willing to pay for good workmanship & will pay for expertise but I guess I would find your prices too high!

Erm, I didn't cost for full bags of ingredients, I didn't post that, Earthstorm did. My costing wasn't just for ingredients, it was for everything and is accurate. The actual cost of the ingredients alone is a couple of quid.

And MY madeira cake takes 2 hours to bake, thanks for the link but I use a recipe that is tried and tested and has been adapted over 3 years. I think you'll find most professional cake makers bake their madeiras for around this time, it gives an even bake, a moist but firm sponge. (I recently purchased a PDF tutorial from a very respected baker and she bakes hers for 3 hours....)

Also, no I don't just stare at the mixer when the butter/sugar is mixing, I usually grease and line the cake tin, crack the eggs in a bowl ready to add.

It's great that YOU can get a cake in the oven in that time, I used to in the early days of my business but I prefer a cake that rises properly as opposed to a dense cake that is only 2" deep.

I would charge £40 minimum for an 8" madeira cake, that is at least 3" deep, filled with jam and buttercream, covered in sugarpaste or marzipan and decorated in hand made decorations. Might seem a lot, but it's what people are prepared to pay for a good quality cake.

This thread does seem to have lost it's way a bit. But I hope my advice which is based on experience, will help the OP in some way.

notanewuser

hayley11 wrote: »

10 minutes to get cake in the oven....wow, what type of cake is that? I make a madeira most of the time as it's strong and will hold the icing and decorations well. It takes me about 30 minutes easy to weigh everything out and get the cake in the oven, longer if it's a bigger cake.

But then I mix the butter and sugar for a good 10 minutes on it's own to ensure it's very light, then mixing the eggs, flour etc. These all take time to ensure a light and fluffy cake. I could just throw everything into the mixer and be done with it but then my cake wouldn't be very nice. An 8" cake then takes two hours to bake, while that's baking, i'll do the washing up and clean down the kitchen, that takes maybe another 30 minutes to do a thorough job. I don't include the other 90 minutes in my costing at my full hourly rate but I do charge for these, I am using electricity afterall.

All sorts - carrot/passion cake (oil, not butter), chocolate cake (butter gets melted with chocolate), Madeira (Lindy's recepe/method works a treat) and fruit cake I chuck the butter and sugar in the kitchenaid on 4 for a minute or so to combine, then whack it up to 8 or 10 for about 5 mins while I weigh out the other ingredients. I always fold the flour in by hand because that shouldn't be overworked. The kitchenaid grates the carrots, and any dried fruit gets soaked overnight. I like deep cakes so they're always at least 3" in depth and I tend to trim to 2-2.5" for sponge before sandwiching to make a 4-5" depth.


For round cakes I use pushpans which don't need lining. For any size square from 1" to 12" I use a folding Silverwood tin and line the whole base (putting the paper under the sides if you are what I mean) and I have a roll of baking paper cut through to the right height so I can just whip it around the sides without any fiddling.

I only make for friends, but a wedding cake I made recently (1 choc, 1 vanilla, 1 fruit) cost me around £60 in ingredients and electricity to make, but only around 2 hours in prep and a day in decorating.

Laurajo_2

Mmm......caaaaake!

I do think OPs business plan is flawed....I know I probably shouldn't say this, but I think if most people wanted to buy a 'plain' cake, they would probably just go to a supermarket or bakers...and I'm guessing the prices charged in order to make a reasonable profit are going to be much higher....